[Solved] Right way to install sid?

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Re: [Solved] Right way to install sid?

Postby GarryRicketson » 2017-12-09 14:23

Many people, (me included) don't like to actually join the mailing lists,
You can also view them , with out joining, they have them archived.
I just keep the links to the ones I am interested in book marked,.. they
get updated pretty regularly (most are ever 24 hours),... If you do need
to you can still send a e-mail to the mailing list , with out joining, but then
you do need to keep checking the archive, to see what replies,if any ....
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Re: [Solved] Right way to install sid?

Postby wizard10000 » 2017-12-09 16:10

GarryRicketson wrote:Many people, (me included) don't like to actually join the mailing lists,
You can also view them , with out joining, they have them archived.
I just keep the links to the ones I am interested in book marked,.. they
get updated pretty regularly (most are ever 24 hours),... If you do need
to you can still send a e-mail to the mailing list , with out joining, but then
you do need to keep checking the archive, to see what replies,if any ....


Yup. I have a mail rule that just dumps them in a folder and I glance at the subject lines real quick and then empty the folder :)
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Re: [Solved] Right way to install sid?

Postby dilberts_left_nut » 2017-12-09 19:53

wizard10000 wrote:Last, *do not* use apt's dist-upgrade or full-upgrade with Testing or Sid unless you know exactly what you're doing. Plain old apt upgrade will hold back packages that aren't ready for release.

I disagree with this.

"full-upgrade" is *required* with testing/sid as it will remove packages when necessary to upgrade/install new versions with different depends/package names, which happens a lot.

If you just run standard upgrades, your system will get out of sync with "current" and there will be a growing list of "held back" packages, eventually creating an "impossible" situation.

Both methods call the apt-listbugs hooks, when installed, to warn of packages with open bugs.
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Re: [Solved] Right way to install sid?

Postby wizard10000 » 2017-12-09 20:34

dilberts_left_nut wrote:I disagree with this.

"full-upgrade" is *required* with testing/sid as it will remove packages when necessary to upgrade/install new versions with different depends/package names, which happens a lot.


That's why I said "unless you know exactly what you're doing". :mrgreen:

Debian documentation recommends using dist-upgrade with Testing or Sid - I choose to only use it every couple weeks when I have the bandwidth to pay attention to apt's output. Right now upgrade and dist-upgrade produce identical output on my system.

dist-upgrade will also break the hell out of your system if you're not paying attention. When working with metapackages the last thing to be upgraded is the metapackage itself. dist-upgrade will happily give your metapackage a partial upgrade and overwrite or mark the old pieces for autoremoval if the metapackage isn't ready and there's nothing apt-listbugs can do about that. Been there, did that - I think we all have at some point :)

dilberts_left_nut wrote:If you just run standard upgrades, your system will get out of sync with "current" and there will be a growing list of "held back" packages, eventually creating an "impossible" situation.


Agreed.

dilberts_left_nut wrote:Both methods call the apt-listbugs hooks, when installed, to warn of packages with open bugs.


True, but apt-listbugs won't save you from a partial upgrade :)
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Re: [Solved] Right way to install sid?

Postby dilberts_left_nut » 2017-12-09 20:40

wizard10000 wrote:That's why I said "unless you know exactly what you're doing". :mrgreen:

Which you should if running testing / sid.
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Re: [Solved] Right way to install sid?

Postby arochester » 2017-12-09 20:41

I like this. Careful. Belt and braces: viewtopic.php?f=10&t=131073&p=633278&hilit=dibl#p633248
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Re: [Solved] Right way to install sid?

Postby wizard10000 » 2017-12-09 20:47

dilberts_left_nut wrote:Which you should if running testing / sid.


Also true. OP said he wanted to experiment - I would never tell a n00b to dist-upgrade Sid but that's just me. Debian's documentation disagrees and I should have been more clear :mrgreen:
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Re: [Solved] Right way to install sid?

Postby wizard10000 » 2017-12-09 20:50

arochester wrote:I like this. Careful. Belt and braces: viewtopic.php?f=10&t=131073&p=633278&hilit=dibl#p633248


I like it too. Best readme I've seen on the subject.
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Re: [Solved] Right way to install sid?

Postby GarryRicketson » 2017-12-09 20:52

It is funny though, how sometimes what starts out as a experiment, and even using a VM, after awhile the experiment is really working good, and one has
a lot of work into it,... one mistake and all that work lost. I make a copy/snapshot of the VM before doing anything that might change that.
Same if it is real hardware,.. and that applies to even if it is a "stable" version.
good habit to get into.
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Re: [Solved] Right way to install sid?

Postby michapma » 2017-12-11 12:17

wizard10000 wrote:
arochester wrote:I like this. Careful. Belt and braces: viewtopic.php?f=10&t=131073&p=633278&hilit=dibl#p633248


I like it too. Best readme I've seen on the subject.

Thanks for posting that, arochester. Gave me some new ideas for good practice. I've only been using a reduced version by carefully observing packages to be removed and reading the output of apt-listbugs. Pretty sure I won't drop down to the terminal for every dist-upgrade, though.
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