Help me to not give up and go away from Linux

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Help me to not give up and go away from Linux

Postby Axopro » 2005-08-22 03:56

Hi guys..
I have a few questions about problems i am having with Debian sarge and kde.
And also need some advice about what to do when you are a noob and things don't work like one expect after reading about how good Linux is and that stuff..

Ok.. im having a hard time trying to install my sound card driver.
I had a lot of problems too installing the Nvidia driver for my video card.. to the point that i ended having it working on a different kernel (2.6.8-2-686 instead 2.6.8-2-386 that was installed at first) and the bad things is that i have no clue about how i did it after trying copy and paste commands from different websites that help me.

Ok.. back to the sound card.
I downloaded the driver.. and im following the steps in it. But here is a part of the output. I see there are errors... and that is why i can not make it work.
My big question is... how does a new Linux user deals with stuff like this when something goes wrong. (i have installed lets say 6 different things and nothing was friendly or working right after finishing with the instructions that come with it)

log:

axo-debian:~/audio/alsa-driver-1.0.10rc1/alsa-driver-1.0.10rc1# ./configure
checking for gcc... gcc
checking for C compiler default output... a.out
checking whether the C compiler works... yes
checking whether we are cross compiling... no
checking for suffix of executables...
checking for suffix of object files... o
checking whether we are using the GNU C compiler... yes
checking whether gcc accepts -g... yes

blah blah blah blah.... very long stuff... and then i get:

make[2]: Leaving directory `/root/audio/alsa-driver-1.0.10rc1/alsa-driver-1.0.10rc1/pcmcia'
make[1]: Leaving directory `/root/audio/alsa-driver-1.0.10rc1/alsa-driver-1.0.10rc1'
make -C /lib/modules/2.6.8-2-686/source SUBDIRS=/root/audio/alsa-driver-1.0.10rc1/alsa-driver-1.0.10rc1 O=/lib/modules/2.6.8-2-686/build modules
make: *** /lib/modules/2.6.8-2-686/source: No such file or directory. Stop.
make: *** [compile] Error 2

Installation stops....

at this point ... i guess something went wrong with the installer.
But because i am a noob and dont understand whats going on.. i keep following the instructions in the readme file...:

axo-debian:~/audio/alsa-driver-1.0.10rc1/alsa-driver-1.0.10rc1# make install
find /lib/modules/2.6.8-2-686/kernel/sound -name 'snd*.*o' | xargs rm -f
make[1]: Entering directory `/root/audio/alsa-driver-1.0.10rc1/alsa-driver-1.0.10rc1/acore'
mkdir -p /lib/modules/2.6.8-2-686/kernel/sound/acore
cp snd-hpet.ko snd-hwdep.ko snd-page-alloc.ko snd-pcm.ko snd-rawmidi.ko snd-rtctimer.ko snd-timer.ko snd.ko /lib/modules/2.6.8-2-686/kernel/sound/acore
cp: cannot stat `snd-hpet.ko': No such file or directory
cp: cannot stat `snd-hwdep.ko': No such file or directory
cp: cannot stat `snd-page-alloc.ko': No such file or directory
cp: cannot stat `snd-pcm.ko': No such file or directory
cp: cannot stat `snd-rawmidi.ko': No such file or directory
cp: cannot stat `snd-rtctimer.ko': No such file or directory
cp: cannot stat `snd-timer.ko': No such file or directory
cp: cannot stat `snd.ko': No such file or directory
make[1]: *** [modules_install] Error 1
make[1]: Leaving directory `/root/audio/alsa-driver-1.0.10rc1/alsa-driver-1.0.10rc1/acore'
make: *** [install-modules] Error 1

At this point it is obious for me that if i continue following the instructions, the sound card will not work.
Actually.. i completed all the steps just to make sure...
No go.

the help files are a bunch of technical stuff that most of the average linux user might not understand. They are also very very long.


I dont know if anyone here could give me a straight answer to fix my sound card problem, but i am just looking for an answer like what to do with the installation files when they do not work. is there any other way to use them?

What about stuff like... changing the time in the KDE clock options, and then seeing the same wrong time in there?
now if i type "date" in the command line i get the correct time.. Sun Aug 21 23:40:45 UTC 2005

but KDE is showing me 7:40 at the same moment.
I installed firefox. the web browser...
but i had to find the executable files myself and create the shortcuts in KDE because the firefox installation seems to not know how to do this... plus, i had to find the firefox icons to make the shortcuts i created look like "firefox shortcuts".

I installed synaptic package manager.. i think using apt-get
now the shortcut is in the KDE system menu. but if i click it to open the application... nothing happens.... if i click it again... still nothing... and if i click it again.. guess what?... NOTHING. and i liked it more than kpackage when i used gnome in another PC.


So my big question is this:

Will i have to deal with stuff like this each time i want to install something or use anything on the PC, having Debian or any other Linux system installed in my PC?
I am a technician with very advanced skills in windows,, and want to learn and start doing stuff in Linux... but im getting very frustrated after spending days trying to do very basic stuff in Debian.

Sorry for the long post... and i hope some of you can give me some answers..
thanks a lot.
Axopro
 
Posts: 12
Joined: 2005-07-10 16:39

Postby Harold » 2005-08-22 06:24

First, read Eric S. Raymond's How to ask questions the smart way.

Second, kernel 2.6 comes with ALSA drivers already installed, unless you are using some really obscure or antique sound card. Of course, since you haven't told us what kind of video card you are using, that makes it kind of difficult for us to help you, doesn't it? Go read this thread about Configuring ALSA.

Third, is the standard XFree86 nVidia driver not working for you? What is it not doing?

Fourth, apt-get install ntpdate and your system clock will be adjusted every time your computer boots.

Fifth, go back and re-read that section of ESR's diatribe where he talks about using meaningful, specific subject headers.

Sixth, apt-get install menu, get to a console prompt and type man update-menus. If you want to print the man page, then do man -t update-menus | lpr. (Now go back and figure out what ntpdate does.)

Seventh, pick a distro and stay with it!

Eighth, invest in one or two good linux books. For instance...
Debian System
Linux Cookbook, 1st Ed. No Starch
Linux Cookbook, 2nd Ed. No Starch
How Linux Works
Linux Cookbook O'Reilly
Running Linux

No Starch was the first out with Running Linux; I don't know why O'Reilly came out later with the same title. No Starch 1st and 2nd editions are very different books and, in my opinion, 1st Ed. is the better of the two. Since it is still being offered for sale, there must be other people that agree with me.
Harold
 
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Joined: 2005-01-07 00:15

Postby Guest » 2005-08-22 14:48

Thanks for the suggestions Harold..

The sound card i am talking about is the Realtek ALC861 High Definition Audio 8-channel CODEC that is integrated in my Asus P5GD1 motherboard.
I downloaded a package from realtek (Asus does not have any linux driver in their website). inside the package there are 3 parts of the ALSA drivers.
The Alsa drivers that came inside this package, failed to install, and are an older version that the current 1.0.10 version i downloaded from www.alsa-project.org.
The newer version is also failing.. and i already gave you the errors i got.

The video card i was talking about is a Gforce 6600GT 128MB. And it is already working. Just that i don't know how, i ended with another kernel. Do not need help with the video card... thanks.

Thank you for the links to the smart way of asking questions...
I am just on the STUPID kind of guy category because i wouldn't know how to use a more technical subject in my post like " Fatal exception I/O 055497x4584 memory adress AN258 chip 5, ALSA & Realtek codec driver compilation", until i can be on the "Smarter" category, after i start understanding more about Linux.

I will try the apt-get install menu command to learn what it does... thank you again.

I picked Debian because i read a lot about it, and it is supposed to be the most stable, and 100% linux of all. I am not switching distros at all.. am staying here.

I guess KDE lacks stability and comes with thousands of bugs yet, as i keep having minor GUI problems in it... ill keep trying though

Thanks again for the replies...

Bye
Guest
 

Postby Harold » 2005-08-22 23:41

I am not a fan-boy of on-board sound, video or network circuitry. The quality is always inferior, and they are always a pain in the keister to configure. It's like buying a house and opening the garage door to find a Yugo parked inside. I disable on-board circuitry and install PCI/AGP boards. I paid $20US for a Netgear NIC, $25US for a Soundblaster PCI-16, and $50US for ATI 9200 AGP video. Money well invested, I say.

Realtek ALC861. Looking at the ALSA section of the kernel 2.6.11 .config file, not one of the drivers jumps out at me as applicable. Let's go look for the website.

Axopro> I downloaded a package from realtek (Asus does not have any linux driver in their website)

I would not expect to find the drivers anywhere but the Realtek website. Ok, found them here, dated 2005/08/08. Is this the same driver you downloaded? Download... Untar... Readme.txt... It says that these are ALSA drivers? How are they identified in the kernel? I'll come back to this later tonight.

Axopro> I guess KDE lacks stability and comes with thousands of bugs yet, as i keep having minor GUI problems in it... ill keep trying though

99% of people new to Linux start out either with KDE or GNOME (or both). Some people stay with one or the other. Some people shop around and find a desktop environment more to their liking. I use Xfce. We also have people around here that swear by Fluxbox, IceWM, Windowmaker, Enlightenment, Ion... Let us know when you get the urge to explore.

Axopro> Thank you for the links to the smart way of asking questions... I am just on the STUPID kind of guy category because i wouldn't know how to use a more technical subject in my post like " Fatal exception I/O 055497x4584 memory adress AN258 chip 5, ALSA & Realtek codec driver compilation", until i can be on the "Smarter" category, after i start understanding more about Linux.

There is another HOWTO out there that I keep taped to my wall and have been know to e-mail to certain other forum members. Not this forum, you understand. Other forums. This forum has great people. :-) How to help someone use a computer While I agree with much of what ESR says, there are parts of his HOWTO that are too rough around the edges for my tastes. Phil Agre's HOWTO nicely balances ESR's intensity. One of the things Phil says is Beginners face a language problem: they can't ask questions because they don't know what the words mean, they can't know what the words mean until they can successfully use the system, and they can't successfully use the system because they can't ask questions. Makes perfect sense to me. :-)
Harold
 
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Joined: 2005-01-07 00:15

Postby Harold » 2005-08-23 01:39

I downloaded the latest Realtek drivers, untarred them, and studied both the auto-install script and the manual-install instructions. The procedures are so shoddy that I'm not willing to experiment with them on my computer. The manual-install procedure branches it instructions for various Realtek chipsets, and the ALC861 isn't listed on any of those branches.

There is no mention of either Realtek or ALC861 at www.alsa-project.org, nor are there references in the Kernel 2.6.11 config file. Went googling and found a link to an ALC AC97 driver that supports ALC861 on Microsoft OS. Linux Kernel does have something called an AC97 codec.

My advice is to follow the procedure I posted in this thread. Either it works or it doesn't. If it doesn't, then disable the realtek chip in your BIOS, and install a sound card from a reputable manufacturer.
Harold
 
Posts: 1502
Joined: 2005-01-07 00:15

Postby Axopro » 2005-08-23 03:37

Thanks Harold for your every time useful input...

Yes.. that is the driver i downloaded from realtek.
But Realtek has just one "High definition audio codec" Driver in the website when going to the download section... that means that it should support all their versions. But nevermind.
ALC861 must be a number they created for Asus, to include the codec in the boards.


Anyway... here are the good news...
I did remember that i listened to music some time ago, when i used one of the live CDs before i decided to install Debian.
And guess what.
It is Kanotix. Kernel 2.6.1... and Kanotix is debian :)
Right now i am using it and i have the 6ch option in Kmix and everything. It works fine.

So i was thinking... instead of dealing with all that crap about the ALSA driver and Realtek... why not just copy the configuration that Kanotix live cd used to make my sound work, and use it in the Debian installation.

I do not have any idea if this is possible.. and even if it would be easier than the other way. The good thing is that this codec works somehow in debian, so i should be able to
do it in the HD installation

I need some advice. Please.

Thanks
Axopro
 
Posts: 12
Joined: 2005-07-10 16:39

Postby Axopro » 2005-08-23 03:57

Here..
I took a pic of the info

Click here

....
Axopro
 
Posts: 12
Joined: 2005-07-10 16:39

Postby Harold » 2005-08-23 04:29

Axopro> why not just copy the configuration that Kanotix live cd used to make my sound work, and use it in the Debian installation.

I just spent five minutes poking around /etc/ trying to figure out where those config files hide. No joy. :-)

Let's see who else might know how to do this... Is there a Debian-sound mailing list? Nope. Is there a Debian-multimedia mailing list? Yes, but nothing there but spam. Any books? No Starch has one book on Linux sound, but it is extreme overkill. Let's check the Linux Documentation Project. Nope, half-a-dozen HOWTOs all written 1998-2001. Time to goggle... Garbage! Mass quantities!

Edit 1: ALSA User Forum
Harold
 
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Re: Help me to not give up and go away from Linux

Postby Guest » 2005-08-23 12:28

Axopro wrote:
So my big question is this:

Will i have to deal with stuff like this each time i want to install something or use anything on the PC, having Debian or any other Linux system installed in my PC?
I am a technician with very advanced skills in windows,, and want to learn and start doing stuff in Linux... but im getting very frustrated after spending days trying to do very basic stuff in Debian.




I'm not writing to lend any help, Harold seems to be all over that, I just wanted to sympathize. I've started using Debian and am not a technician (I'm just very stubborn), so I feel like I'm going through what you are x5.

I feel that perhaps if they had made the symbol for Linux a huge multi-armed octopus that never stops thrashing it's tentacles at you, then it would have been a more appropriate symbol for the system. Every task I want to get to work (Installatin, Internet setup, installing Xwindows and GNOME, plus a million smaller things) is a struggle. Every task I just listed was like grabbing one of millions of slimy tentacles and tryin to get it to do my will instead of its own. :)

On the plus side, I seem to be learning a lot, despite much frustration. I'm gonna keep wrestling with the octopus for now.. maybe he'll sortof start behaving in a few years.


Durandal
Penguins are much friendlier than an Octopus
Guest
 

Postby buggycode » 2005-08-25 06:00

Hi

Hi Just stumbled across this thread while hunting for a solution for my Leadtek Winfast 6600GT 128 video card.

The system I attempted to install Debian onto has the following hardware:
- Gigabyte GA-7VT600 1394
- Leadtek Winfast 6600GT 128 video card
- 1 Maxtor ATA drive
- 1 Seagate SATA drive
- 1 Pioneer 107 DVD writer.
- BENQ 17FPE+ screen.

I initially installed Sarge without X and tried installing it at a later stage. I installed xfree86-common and some other parts (can't remember of the top of my head) and tried to prepare the system to run WindowMaker.
After I thought I completed all the parts (intallation-wise), I ran startX and
just received an error that something to effect of that the display could not be found. (I am using the the DVI connection of the card)

I know it works as I had GNOME running via a KNOPPIX boot.

A little confusing. I sure I missed something(s)

BuggyCode
buggycode
 
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Postby Harold » 2005-08-25 07:02

su to root and apt-get update && apt-get install x-window-system-core xterm wmaker wmakerconf

Then, to make sure that X is properly configured, do:
dpkg-reconfigure xfree86-common
dpkg-reconfigure xserver-common
dpkg-reconfigure xserver-xfree86
# Looks like your video card uses an nVidia chipset. Choose the nv driver.
exit to your user account.

Finally, start Windowmaker with the command xinit /usr/bin/wmaker
Harold
 
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Joined: 2005-01-07 00:15


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