new kernel 5.6 and I cannot boot, but I could on 5.3

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new kernel 5.6 and I cannot boot, but I could on 5.3

Postby MagicPoulp » 2020-07-14 03:50

With kernel 5.5.17-1~bpo10+1 on buster I can boot fine. But not with 5.6.

With a debian dist-upgrade, I got a new kernel 5.6. But the PC does not boot any more I get stuck on a black screen, without any text shown.
In rescue mode, I can see the text. It mainly mentions some usb stuff. By the way I am booting on a USB drive.

At the end I get this warning
ACPI Warning: \_SB.PCI0.PEG0.PEGP._DSM: Argument #4 type mismatch - Found [Buffer], ACPI requires [Package] (20180313/nsarguments-66)

and then an extra line that says "failed to evaluate _DSM". And the same error line contains "_SB.PCI0.PEG0.PEGP._DSM".
and the last line says "switching to nouveau [...]"

My computer has an NVIDIA GPU.

I searched and I could not find a fix. Help would be appreciated.

I found this similar issue:
viewtopic.php?f=6&t=137096

Note I have XFCE and no gnome was installed from the debian installer.


Note: The debian installer allows to have backports sources to download. ANd I have kept the apt config from the installer. So I installed a kernel linux-image-amd64 from buster-backports. And then it got upgraaded automatically. I know I can lock this in the preferences. But it may be interesting to try the new backported kernel when there is one. So I keep it that way.
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Re: new kernel 5.6 and I cannot boot, but I could on 5.3

Postby Head_on_a_Stick » 2020-07-14 19:49

Regressions are unfortunately common, this is why Debian stable keeps the same kernel version. Do you actually need the backported kernel?
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Re: new kernel 5.6 and I cannot boot, but I could on 5.3

Postby stevepusser » 2020-07-15 03:43

This is what happens when you use a backports kernel without updating the nonfree Nvidia driver from backports also. I'm assuming that's what you're using from your meager information (if you have a graphics problem you should provide your hardware and driver information, amiright?). So that is not a surprise.

The same goes for other third-party drivers you may be using, such as broadcom-sta, virtualbox, etc.
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Re: new kernel 5.6 and I cannot boot, but I could on 5.3

Postby MagicPoulp » 2020-07-15 06:36

I need the backported kernel otherwise my usb drive is not bootable.

I never installed nvidia non-free drivers. I stick to nouveau as HeadOnAStick said several times.

But I do not have a big issue. I can still boot on the 5.5 kernel. If I want I can disable automatic upgrades from backports. I was just curious what happens with this kernel 5.6. The error printout is very meager. Maybe 5.6 can work with nvidia proprietary drivers but I prefer not to try.

Regards
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Re: new kernel 5.6 and I cannot boot, but I could on 5.3

Postby stevepusser » 2020-07-16 05:17

Some hardware still needs non-free firmware for the nouveau driver, and those file requirements can change for newer kernels. Debian has the nouveau firmware in firmware-misc-nonfree, though the buster-backports version may be somewhat older than the 5.6 kernel, at about a year.

I'm not saying that's the problem for sure, but installing the newer firmware from backports is perfectly safe for older kernels, too.
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Re: new kernel 5.6 and I cannot boot, but I could on 5.3

Postby MagicPoulp » 2020-07-16 07:51

OK thanks now I understand you better. Previously you said "NVIDIA driver".

Maybe we need a different definition for firmware and driver.

https://superuser.com/questions/299442/ ... ice-driver
"Firmware implements low-level details that are required to operate the hardware, and provides an API/ABI to a higher level. A device driver provides an adapter between the OS and the API/ABI exposed by the firmware."

I have installed all the non-free firmwares I could a few months ago.
I got hte list in the zip: and then I installed using apt-get on non-free
http://cdimage.debian.org/cdimage/unoff ... /20200209/

I have to check how I installed those. Probably not from backports.

But yes you may be right that the kernel 5.6 is not in sync with those firmwares.
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Re: new kernel 5.6 and I cannot boot, but I could on 5.3

Postby Mr. Lumbergh » 2020-07-30 20:40

I recently had trouble with the RT version of 5.6, but with re-initializing USB ports through a sleep/wake cycle instead of booting; they weren't even getting power.
Check out the 5.4 kernel, it's considered an LTS release that'll be getting 6 years of maintenance: https://fossbytes.com/linux-lts-kernel-4-19-and-5-4-will-now-be-supported-for-6-years-instead-of-2/.
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Re: new kernel 5.6 and I cannot boot, but I could on 5.3

Postby MagicPoulp » 2020-08-03 09:45

Good to know.

I cannot, the buster-backports has only 5.3 and 5.6.

Maybe in the future it will show up.
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Re: new kernel 5.6 and I cannot boot, but I could on 5.3

Postby Mr. Lumbergh » 2020-08-03 15:29

MagicPoulp wrote:Good to know.

I cannot, the buster-backports has only 5.3 and 5.6.

Maybe in the future it will show up.

It should be available in the main repos, that's where I'm getting it.
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Re: new kernel 5.6 and I cannot boot, but I could on 5.3

Postby djk44883 » 2020-08-03 21:32

If you're running stable... and want to keep things stable isn't "best practice" apt get upgrade / apt-get upgrade ?

Because apt full-upgrade / apt-get dist-upgrade, not only upgrades but installs new and it may remove some. note: install new is not upgrade already installed.
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Re: new kernel 5.6 and I cannot boot, but I could on 5.3

Postby Bulkley » 2020-08-03 23:00

djk44883 wrote:If you're running stable... and want to keep things stable isn't "best practice" apt get upgrade / apt-get upgrade ?


I think you mean
Code: Select all
# apt-get update && apt-get upgrade
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Re: new kernel 5.6 and I cannot boot, but I could on 5.3

Postby stevepusser » 2020-08-04 04:05

The present definitions of firmware and drivers are correct. There are free nouveau drivers, but those may require some non-free firmware for some hardware, and newer kernels may require newer versions of the firmware files.

The non-free drivers from Nvidia in the repos will install both the driver and firmware they use. The recent updates for those in Buster for security reasons also made them able to build on newer kernels.

Debian has finally updated the firmware upstream, and they should make their way into backports pretty soon, if not already. I don't think that Debian has backported the 5.7 kernels yet, though I've done it successfully for MX Linux and here:

https://build.opensuse.org/package/show ... source-5.7

There's firmware backports in that repo, too.
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Re: new kernel 5.6 and I cannot boot, but I could on 5.3

Postby djk44883 » 2020-08-04 08:14

Bulkley wrote:
djk44883 wrote:If you're running stable... and want to keep things stable isn't "best practice" apt get upgrade / apt-get upgrade ?


I think you mean
Code: Select all
# apt-get update && apt-get upgrade


First post says they did dist-upgrade ? Suggest they used apt-get (dated). I was showing examples for either atp or apt-get

In the end - to remain stable, avoid apt-get dist-upgrade OR apt full-upgrade

Adding packages and/or removing while upgrading can lead to, well a non-booting system?
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Re: new kernel 5.6 and I cannot boot, but I could on 5.3

Postby MagicPoulp » 2020-08-04 11:07

I am 100% sure dist-upgrade is correct on debian. (but very dangerous on Ubuntu if you have experience there). If dist-upgrade breaks your debian, then you did not follow the anti franken debian best practices.
run man apt-get

yes dist-upgrade resolves cross dependencies and can replace several packages.
The debian installer had configured my apt-sources to automatically upgrade also buster-backports. I changed the preferences. And i locked my kernel in the grub config.

it is not possible you got a kernel 5.x from the main repo since buster was frozen on 4.19.

--
stepusser:
ok interesting to understand the flow of firmwares in debian.

But I never really had a problem. I had a working kernel, and I had configured my apt preferences to upgrade the backports.
So I just froze my kernel for now on. But I was curious because the booting was very scarce on errors information.

In the future, I may want the 5.4 LTS when it is in a good shape on Debian.
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Re: new kernel 5.6 and I cannot boot, but I could on 5.3

Postby MagicPoulp » 2020-08-04 11:22

Stevepusser,

I have many packages firmware-* installed from the stable repo of debian. such as firmware-linux-free.
The backported kernel 5.3 worked immediately. But 5.6 broke.

It really seems that the firmwares in stable were not ready to syn with the kernel 5.6. For this I can just wait for them to update them, or fetch them from buster-backports. I did not try fetching them from backports.

And maybe extra tweaks would be needed. Like the intel tweak and the nvidia tweak. You said those once I cannot find where. What are those?

Besides, the bios is updated.
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