Clock runs too fast! What's wrong?

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Clock runs too fast! What's wrong?

Postby BaK » 2006-05-17 20:07

Hi everyone... I hope someone can help me with this issue!

I have a HP Pavilion zv6007us notebook, with a AMD 3200+ 64bits CPU. I have a Debian i386 system installed on it, but i'm facing a problem i can't solve! My clock runs too fast! If i set the right time now, for example, in an hour it'll be 6 or more hours in future. And it's the CMOS clock Debian is messing with. Because when i go back to Windows (sorry, i have to use this &$@$*!), time is messed too.

I suspect it's some kind of incompatibility of my CPU and the i386 Debian. But i can not change to the AMD64 version... I use a lot of things that cannot be ran under it.

Please, someone help me!

Valeu a ajuda!
BaK
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Postby domecq » 2006-05-17 20:24

Have you discussed this issue with HP?
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Postby BaK » 2006-05-19 13:43

They don't support Linux in their notebooks... I think neither in their desktops... I couldn't find anything about this. Have anyone heard or seen this issue in any other 64bits system? Desk or lap?
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Postby domecq » 2006-05-19 13:58

BaK wrote:They don't support Linux in their notebooks... I think neither in their desktops... I couldn't find anything about this. Have anyone heard or seen this issue in any other 64bits system? Desk or lap?

I was not referring to Linux support, instead...
BaK wrote:I have a HP Pavilion zv6007us notebook, with a AMD 3200+ 64bits CPU. I have a Debian i386 system installed on it, but i'm facing a problem i can't solve! My clock runs too fast! If i set the right time now, for example, in an hour it'll be 6 or more hours in future. And it's the CMOS clock Debian is messing with. Because when i go back to Windows (sorry, i have to use this &$@$*!), time is messed too.

...I was referring to your computer itself because, as you mentioned yourself, the problem also happens in Windows, thus you should report this to HP.
I suspect your computer needs a BIOS update.
I heard about this problem in HP computers and that a BIOS update solves this.
Since updating a BIOS is not a simple task, you should ask for HP support on that.
And maybe I'm wrong and it has nothing to do with BIOS. It could be something else, and, if you tell HP support that this does not happen only in Linux and happens in Windows too, then they could support you.
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Postby Grifter » 2006-05-19 14:08

This is why you use ntpd (:
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Postby domecq » 2006-05-19 16:07

Grifter wrote:This is why you use ntpd (:

I think ntpd comes to have machines sychronized so that they can run specific time-dependant tasks.
It's not a solution for problems like this. After all, a computer is supposed to have it's time running OK.
Another thing: you cannot use ntpd in a computer which is not connected to the Internet all the time.
This case seems very much that the BIOS or another component is in need of an update. I've seen it around.
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Postby Grifter » 2006-05-19 16:10

not as i understand it, all computer clocks will differ because they base their clocks on the cpu frequency which is not always stable, so there's always drift

without ntpd running my clocks would drift (at different speeds), but having ntpd my clocks are always perfect (:

edit: having a computer not connected to the internet? i admit this did not even occur to me, why have a computer if you can't have it connected to the internet (:

anyway you can always set it up so it syncs whenever you come online

computers without internet, hehe, what a ludicrous idea (:
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Postby domecq » 2006-05-19 16:29

Grifter wrote:not as i understand it, all computer clocks will differ because they base their clocks on the cpu frequency which is not always stable, so there's always drift

without ntpd running my clocks would drift (at different speeds), but having ntpd my clocks are always perfect (:

And talking about drifts, ntpd can only compensate for a certain amount of drift (500 PPM I believe).
Again, ntpd is not meant to correct this problem, rather to have computers synchronized, for example, in a cluster, to perform certain tasks that cannot afford lack of synchronization.
CPUs frequency can be variable but, come on, computer manufacturers might have anticipated that in a way to prevent this sort of problem.
Grifter wrote:edit: having a computer not connected to the internet? i admit this did not even occur to me, why have a computer if you can't have it connected to the internet (:

anyway you can always set it up so it syncs whenever you come online

computers without internet, hehe, what a ludicrous idea (:

Well, thank you for distorting what I wrote. I never said computers without Internet, rather, I said not connected to the Internet all the time. Yet, you are assuming something wrong, that everyone has to have Internet connection to have computer. It doesn't make sense. A computer can serve for other things than only surfing the web or checking emails. Think about that. ;)
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Postby BaK » 2006-05-19 16:34

Sorry, domecq... I didn't explain it so well. I said time was also messed in Windows to prove it's CMOS time Linux is updating, not the kernel internal clock. Under Windows, seconds run normally. If i only ran Windows, time would be ok... But i would be not, since i could kill myself! :)

But i found the solution! It's some kind of grub configuration. I didn't test it yet, 'cause i'm on work right now, but if anyone wants to try, the URL is:

ensode.net/no_time_check.html

I hope it works...

See y'all.
BaK
 

Postby domecq » 2006-05-19 16:53

BaK wrote:Sorry, domecq... I didn't explain it so well. I said time was also messed in Windows to prove it's CMOS time Linux is updating, not the kernel internal clock. Under Windows, seconds run normally. If i only ran Windows, time would be ok... But i would be not, since i could kill myself!

Hmmm... check something: right-click on your time and see if you have checked an option to use UTC time (which by the way, is a sort of ntpd...). If yes, that could be the cause, uncheck it and see how it works.
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Postby dawgie » 2006-05-19 17:13

It is akernel bug that shows up on some Amd64 systems.

My wifes computer system clock was gaining several hours per day. The harware clock works fine.
A work-around I did for my wife's computer was to add:

disable_timer_pin_1

to the kernel line in Grub.

Or you could install kernel 2.6.16.
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Postby Grifter » 2006-05-19 23:08

domecq wrote:Well, thank you for distorting what I wrote. I never said computers without Internet, rather, I said not connected to the Internet all the time. Yet, you are assuming something wrong, that everyone has to have Internet connection to have computer. It doesn't make sense. A computer can serve for other things than only surfing the web or checking emails. Think about that. ;)


No I didn't distort what you wrote, it's how I see it, a computer without being connected to the internet the whole time, is a computer without internet to me. I used to have a modem back in the day, but for almost 10 years now I've been on broadband, and all my friends are too, we all keep our computers on day round, this is just my way of life, and so a computer that doesn't have internet is very alien to me, I'm sorry you got offended, this is just how I see things.
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Postby domecq » 2006-05-19 23:40

Grifter wrote:No I didn't distort what you wrote, it's how I see it, a computer without being connected to the internet the whole time, is a computer without internet to me. I used to have a modem back in the day, but for almost 10 years now I've been on broadband, and all my friends are too, we all keep our computers on day round, this is just my way of life, and so a computer that doesn't have internet is very alien to me, I'm sorry you got offended, this is just how I see things.

Yes, you really distorted what I wrote. But it's OK that you explained that you meant something else, which would never be understood like something else by anyone, until you explained the idea behind the clear words you used. I'm saying that because in a forum like this, where you see people from all around the planet, trying to communicate in a common language (English in this case), and taking into account the different cultural and language backgrounds, we do need to stick with the words to make things clear. If not, telepathic or psychic powers to guess what people think or mean, would be too much to ask from people.
Now, let me give you some approach to you contrast with your alien concept. A certain university has a room with about 30 computers not connected to the Internet, serving to the only purpose of language lab for people. Such computers need only to have audio capabilities to allow students to speak and hear back what they spoke and compare with a standard speech set in the computer. The sysadmin determined that these computers need no Internet access because the purpose is to have audio only.
You insisted on installing ntpd in this topic, so let me give you another example. There are companies out there that allow their employees to work remotely with the condition of not downloading or activate specific software. Ntpd could be under this definition for business reasons.
Let me know if you want another example OK? ;)
As you see, alien can be a relative concept.
In forums like this, it's a good thing not to impose our visions our concepts because this could clash with other's. Try to help but get the big picture.
One more thing, before I go: I didn't get offended at all. Again, that was how you saw it. And please don't see what I wrote now as an offence, rather it was for the sake of a debate and to show you that you have to think out of the alien box if you want to help people. ;)
Last edited by domecq on 2006-05-19 23:54, edited 1 time in total.
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Postby Grifter » 2006-05-19 23:54

That's certainly true, I'll keep that in mind (:
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Postby BaK » 2006-05-22 19:30

Everyone... I posted the wrong URL. The right one is:

ensode.net/no_timer_check.html

But unfortunatly it did't work for me... But dawgie's solution did work! So, thanx dawgie!

disable_timer_pin_1 in grub kernel line.

See y'all.
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