A text for admin.

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A text for admin.

Postby hack3rcon » 2017-08-21 08:16

Hello admin.
Some users like "debiman" and "dasein" are in this forum for mock other users and fill thread with bullshit text. Please handle it. I asked some questions and searched internet for find a right answer but I couldn't and asked my questions here but these two users filled my thread with bullshit texts. Please check it.


Thank you.
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Re: A text for admin.

Postby sunrat » 2017-08-22 02:43

You didn't link to the question threads so it's hard to form an opinion. People will often ask questions which already have thousands of answers and can easily be searched, or fail to provide information that may be crucial to solving a problem. Some get upset or abusive when the answers don't satisfy them.
Those two members you mentioned are well known to provide accurate answers to valid questions where relevant info is supplied and for which a relevant answer can not be found by a quick search. They are also well known for calling out people who have failed to supply said info, often even after being asked, or who adopt an aggressive and/or abusive tone in their posts. So without knowing the facts of the case, I can only assume you started bullshit and got it flung back at you. Let it go.
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Re: A text for admin.

Postby steve_v » 2017-08-22 04:22

hack3rcon wrote:I asked some questions and searched internet for find a right answer but I couldn't and asked my questions here but these two users filled my thread with bullshit texts.

Assuming I have the right thread (s), what you did is post a perfect example of how not to ask smart questions.
Failing to provide enough (or in this case any) relevant information is bound to annoy. Providing false information is guaranteed to do so. Creating a second thread with exactly the same shortcomings will only make matters worse.
Everyone here is volunteering their free time, don't be surprised if you get a bit of a smack around for wasting this precious resource. This is not a paid support channel, nor is it the Ubuntu forum - we expect you to do a fair portion of the work yourself.

The users you mention are knowledgable veteran members, if you ask good questions and take the time to do your own troubleshooting (and detail that in your request too), they are very helpful.
If you don't, they can have short tempers... just like me. :twisted:

Not mine, but relevant:
Ubuntu forums try to be like a coffee shop in Seattle. Debian forums strive for the charm and ambience of a skinhead bar in Bacau. We intend to keep it that way.
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Re: A text for admin.

Postby GarryRicketson » 2017-08-22 06:47

HOWTO contact forum moderators/admins
You all ready submitted several reports to several posts.
Plus several posts with your complaints:
Postby hack3rcon » I don't like to write rude text here. Just leave me and please don't answer to my questions. If you not relax then ask admin for remove my post. You are here just for write bullshit and mock others but I know you are an ssho...and don't know anything.

============
http://forums.debian.net/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=134301&p=652577#p652576
================ These 2 are almost duplicates
http://forums.debian.net/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=134301&p=652577#p652577
And excessive use of "full quotes",
And now this topic/thread ,...
by hack3rcon » Please handle it. I asked some questions and searched internet for find a right answer but I couldn't and asked my questions here but these two users filled my thread with bullshit texts. Please check it.

It was handled, the admins locked the other threads, so now you started this one,..
it needs to be locked as well.
Please read this Forum guidelines. Please read before your next post!
6.Do not engage in flame wars. Threads that evolve into flaming will be locked. If you feel attacked; be the better person and ignore it. The moderators are not omnipresent, so if you feel some actions need to be taken please e-mail the moderator team on team@forums.debian.net

================
11.If you feel like your post/ thread has been locked, edited or even removed in error please contact the moderator team via e-mail at team@forums.debian.net.
Summary
The following might get your post EDITED:
- Profanities
- Links to inappropriate websites

12. The following might get your post/ thread LOCKED
- Flaming/ personal attacks
- Obvious trolling
- Thread has wandered way off topic
- Cross posting


Perhaps a ban would would be the best solution.
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Re: A text for admin.

Postby kedaha » 2017-08-22 08:03

Without discussing this particular matter, both Lavene's Forum guidelines and Absent Minded's Please Read. What we expect you have already Done are both posted in a prominent place, in the Announcements section so I think that, ideally, reminding people to do their own searches—if deemed necessary—should be the purview of forum moderators and not other forum members. Then posts which where apparently no prior research has been done (which may or may not be the case), could then be reported whereupon the poster could politely be requested to substantiate the question.
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Re: A text for admin.

Postby Lysander » 2017-08-22 09:44

sunrat wrote:You didn't link to the question threads so it's hard to form an opinion.


I think these are the two topics. I cite these because it will help people to understand what happened and why the OP got the responses he did

viewtopic.php?f=5&t=134301

viewtopic.php?f=5&t=134290

Glad to see that people here have rallied behind the true cause of these forums which is to teach people to do their own research and come back with specific, focused questions citing what they read and what they tried.

I had a crash course in the Debian Way when I first came here, and I'm very appreciative of it. I don't think people learn much through constant hand-holding. Building a knowledge base is key to success with Linux, otherwise you're just playing virtual whack-a-mole.
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Re: A text for admin.

Postby wizard10000 » 2017-08-22 10:07

Lysander wrote:...I don't think people learn much through constant hand-holding.


I've run enterprise helpdesks for years. IMO the quickest, most painless way to get somebody up to speed is to make sure all the information they need is available and after training, shadowing and reverse shadowing, throw them in the deep end of the pool. Even the folks who work for me agree - I asked them :mrgreen:
we see things not as they are, but as we are.
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Re: A text for admin.

Postby Lysander » 2017-08-22 10:20

Topic hijack:

I did not expect to see someone with a Anais Nin quote in their sig, here, Wizard. One of my favourite fiction writers. That is all.

End hijack.
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Re: A text for admin.

Postby kedaha » 2017-08-22 10:54

To add to my previous reply:
On the one hand, It may be the case that some members of these boards have done a lot of searches but don't refer to them and so get aggrieved by reminders to this effect; on the other hand, what they have already done may be irrelevant to an expert who can easily answer the question without taking a school-masterly attitude towards the supposedly recalcitrant pupil by requiring him to show his homework.

My idea is this: When a new post appears like, for example, this:

I can't get the installer to recognize the wireless dongle blablabla; I've done a lot of searches but come up with nothing..it works perfectly in Ubuntu...

Rather than just ignoring the post or telling them in no uncertain terms to read the documentation on the assumption that they've not already done so, simply report the post to a forum moderator who could immediately check this. Then a standard reminder could be posted, or sent automatically to their email address, which would say something like this:

Thank you for your recent forum post.
Subject: Wireless Dongle not working in Debian stretch.
To help other forum members to assist you, please give details of any attempts you have made to solve the problem.


I think such a mechanism would obviate the urge some members feel to continually refer to this requirement, which is has been satisfactorily dealt with in Absent Minded's Please Read: What we expect you to have already done post, thus being able to focus on the issues themselves.
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Re: A text for admin.

Postby golinux » 2017-08-22 13:24

If you try to turn Linux into Windows you will attract users like this.
May the FORK be with you!
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Re: A text for admin.

Postby debiman » 2017-08-24 20:16

it seems some people (not just hackercon) get annoyed on principle when provided with a search link.
i don't see why; sometimes there's more than one solution for a problem, or, more likely, because enough information was not provided, it is not possible to provide exact advice or even solution.
in these cases a well-formulated search term link with a linux user friendly search engine like ddg can be good advice in itself.
i do look at the results before posting something like this.

otoh, other people engage in a sort of "who can guess what this is really about" game. they get it right maybe one out of 10 times, and maybe 5 out of 10 times it causes more harm than good.
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Re: A text for admin.

Postby kopper » 2017-08-25 05:54

debiman wrote:it seems some people (not just hackercon) get annoyed on principle when provided with a search link.
i don't see why; sometimes there's more than one solution for a problem, or, more likely, because enough information was not provided, it is not possible to provide exact advice or even solution.
in these cases a well-formulated search term link with a linux user friendly search engine like ddg can be good advice in itself.
i do look at the results before posting something like this.

otoh, other people engage in a sort of "who can guess what this is really about" game. they get it right maybe one out of 10 times, and maybe 5 out of 10 times it causes more harm than good.


I think you have a great point here. There are lots of topics with easily searchable solutions and lots of topics with zero initial input from the OP which could help his/her cause. I believe that more often than not this is due to the lack of understanding the concept which the problem is related to. I find myself in same kind of situation once in a while where I can't just put my finger on the real issue when working with new stuff. In such cases it should fine that someone offers you the correct search terms.

Then again, sometimes these "search term suggestions" are communicated in rather unapproachable manner, which may be why some people are more reluctant to go with the "easy advise". Maybe the whole issue is relating to different types of communication instead of immature attitude of either party. I've found that while most of the problems with human-machine communication is due to the lack of common language, same goes for the interpersonal communication.

P.S. Before anyone digs up my old posts, I too have given frustrated "look it up" answers before. I'm no saint. :D
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