Should discussion of Ubuntu be censored?

Have something to say about forums.debian.net itself?

Should discussion of Ubuntu be censored?

Yes. Debian only please.
22
19%
50-50. Please censor complaints about Ubuntu.
16
14%
No. Censorship in any form is unacceptable.
79
68%
 
Total votes : 117

Should discussion of Ubuntu be censored?

Postby Soul Singin' » 2010-04-10 05:08

Why does every loser who dislikes Ubuntu or got banned from Ubuntu Forums feel the need to bring his complaint over here? Why do heartbroken Ubuntu users feel the need to search for solace at Debian Forums?

I have no sympathy for them. Their whines and cries irritate me.

So I propose censoring discussion of Ubuntu. Not a complete ban. Just a ban on Ubuntu whininess. If all goes well, the Ubuntu exiles will leave us alone and bother the Fedora people instead. :mrgreen:
.
User avatar
Soul Singin'
 
Posts: 1607
Joined: 2008-12-21 07:02

Re: Should discussion of Ubuntu be censored?

Postby NCCarlos » 2010-04-10 05:29

Poll results now show 100% in favor of banning Ubuntu whining. :lol:

Edit: I'm in favor of debian only. Discussing Ubuntu or any OS is fine in Offtopic, of course.
User avatar
NCCarlos
 
Posts: 35
Joined: 2009-07-02 17:29

Re: Should discussion of Ubuntu be censored?

Postby AdrianTM » 2010-04-10 05:43

1. People who use Ubuntu (or Windows or Fedora or any other OS) and ask for help here should be politely invited to search for help on the appropriate forum.

2. People who constantly bitch about Ubuntu or Ubuntu users should be reminded that this is a Debian forum not a Ubuntu Piñata Fest Forum (it makes Debian users look infantile and frankly idiotic).

3. No censorship should be used, unless people are spamming or trolling.
Ubuntu hate is a mental derangement.
User avatar
AdrianTM
 
Posts: 2520
Joined: 2004-09-19 01:08

Re: Should discussion of Ubuntu be censored?

Postby Soul Singin' » 2010-04-10 05:49

AdrianTM wrote:1. People who use Ubuntu (or Windows or Fedora or any other OS) and ask for help here should be politely invited to search for help on the appropriate forum.

There's a big blue logo on top that says "Debian User Forums." Do you think they missed it?

AdrianTM wrote:2. People who constantly bitch about Ubuntu or Ubuntu users should be reminded that this is a Debian forum not a Ubuntu Piñata Fest Forum (it makes Debian users look infantile and frankly idiotic).

A very good reason to censor Ubuntu whining.

AdrianTM wrote:3. No censorship should be used, unless people are spamming or trolling.

Can we classify Ubuntu whining as "spamming" or "trolling?"
.
Last edited by Soul Singin' on 2010-04-10 06:09, edited 2 times in total.
User avatar
Soul Singin'
 
Posts: 1607
Joined: 2008-12-21 07:02

Re: Should discussion of Ubuntu be censored?

Postby nadir » 2010-04-10 06:00

As far i know kind of whining doesn't work as of now (you might use this or that OS, you will get into trouble. Worst case: ignored, best case: a bit of fun). It's good the way it is.
As said i would rather vote for less than for more rules (if someone would ask me). Spamming sucks, but i think that's clear.

I didn't vote, cause i don't know if it is a joke or a serious question.
"I am not fine with it, so there is nothing for me to do but stand aside." M.D.
User avatar
nadir
 
Posts: 5964
Joined: 2009-10-05 22:06
Location: away

Re: Should discussion of Ubuntu be censored?

Postby AdrianTM » 2010-04-10 06:01

Soul Singin' wrote:Can we classify Ubuntu whining as "spamming" or "trolling?"

Spamming is about promoting a product so unless the intent is to promote Ubuntu (or other OS) this would not constitute spamming.

Trolling involves bad faith, not all the people who ask for help about Ubuntu or on the contrary bitch about Ubuntu do that in bad faith, usually a reminder that this is a Debian forum should suffice, if it becomes a flame fest and the thread doesn't bring anything useful it can be locked, that's something that moderators can decide (can't say that I have big trust in moderators though, I've seen moderators on this forum who don't have even a shred of common-sense and joined in Ubuntu-bashing fest making Debian forums look pretty infantile).

So, no, in conclusion it's not spamming or trolling (unless it is :grin: ) there should be no special rule, people should be directed to the right forums, if the irrelevant (to the thread/forum) discussion doesn't stop the moderators can make the decision to close the thread.

As for "Off topic" threads Ubuntu is a valid subject like any other subject. I don't see why it wouldn't be...
Ubuntu hate is a mental derangement.
User avatar
AdrianTM
 
Posts: 2520
Joined: 2004-09-19 01:08

Re: Should discussion of Ubuntu be censored?

Postby Soul Singin' » 2010-04-10 06:09

AdrianTM wrote:
Soul Singin' wrote:Can we classify Ubuntu whining as "spamming" or "trolling?"

Spamming is about promoting a product so unless the intent is to promote Ubuntu (or other OS) this would not constitute spamming.

OK. I have to concede that point.

AdrianTM wrote:Trolling involves bad faith, not all the people who ask for help about Ubuntu or on the contrary bitch about Ubuntu do that in bad faith,

I do not care if a person legitimately asks for help. What irritates me is the bitching about Ubuntu.

Why are we continually subjected to threads like: Ubuntu the Debian Downgrade? Such threads just invite trash talk about Ubuntu.
.
User avatar
Soul Singin'
 
Posts: 1607
Joined: 2008-12-21 07:02

censured?

Postby llivv » 2010-04-10 06:14

No censuring in a perfect world is what I want. What I'm gonna get! now that is the question?
I sure remember what I got.....
In memory of Ian Ashley Murdock (1973 - 2015) founder of the Debian project.
User avatar
llivv
 
Posts: 5484
Joined: 2007-02-14 18:10
Location: cold storage

Re: Should discussion of Ubuntu be censored?

Postby NCCarlos » 2010-04-10 06:18

Soul Singin' wrote: Such threads just invite trash talk about Ubuntu.
.

Yes, but banning only Ubuntu complaints makes the forum pro-Ubuntu.
User avatar
NCCarlos
 
Posts: 35
Joined: 2009-07-02 17:29

Re: Should discussion of Ubuntu be censored?

Postby AdrianTM » 2010-04-10 06:20

Soul Singin' wrote:I do not care if a person legitimately asks for help. What irritates me is the bitching about Ubuntu.

I agree with you, see my sig... :grin:

However I don't believe in making rules against stupidity. If that would be the solution would have to ban most of the users. It would be enough if forum users made it clear that this is not OK. Till now Debian forum users haven't done that, it means that's OK with them... even more that seems to be the "culture" of this forum, if making fun of... how original... "brown", is what people here consider they have to do to be accepted as true Debian users... what can we do? At most we can make it clear that's idiotic and you can be a valuable Debian user and forum member without kicking other distros.
Ubuntu hate is a mental derangement.
User avatar
AdrianTM
 
Posts: 2520
Joined: 2004-09-19 01:08

Re: Should discussion of Ubuntu be censored?

Postby bzyk » 2010-04-10 06:46

NO CENSURING!
Really - no!
It's doesn't matter what whining is it. You can just ignore him, but censuring... It will be just like on ubuntu forums. Debian is free, so allow for free speech on forum.
Artur 'bzyk' Frydel
In /dev/null no one can hear your scream.
User avatar
bzyk
 
Posts: 10
Joined: 2008-08-11 19:52
Location: Poland

Re: Should discussion of Ubuntu be censored?

Postby Soul Singin' » 2010-04-10 06:55

AdrianTM wrote:However I don't believe in making rules against stupidity.

I don't believe in making rules against stupidity either. Instead, I think we should tax it. Fortunately, most countries have such a tax. It's called the lottery.

AdrianTM wrote:If that would be the solution would have to ban most of the users.

That's fine with me.

AdrianTM wrote:even more that seems to be the "culture" of this forum, if making fun of... how original... "brown", is what people here consider they have to do to be accepted as true Debian users... what can we do? At most we can make it clear that's idiotic and you can be a valuable Debian user and forum member without kicking other distros.

Let me place that in a different context:

even more that seems to be the "culture" of this country, if making fun of "negroes" is what people here consider they have to do to be accepted as true Americans... what can we do? At most we can make it clear that's idiotic and you can be a valuable American and true patriot without lynching other races.


But America didn't take that approach. Instead, legislation was passed in 1964 to outlaw discrimination and racial segregation. Subsequent to that legislation were a large number of hate crimes laws. The result has been (in my opinion) a more tolerant country.

The same is true here. Make it a rule that you have to respect the fact that this is a Debian Forum. This is not the appropriate place to whine about the moderators over at Ubuntu Forums. Nor is it the proper place to announce your disappointment with Ubuntu because the upgrade from Pesty Possum to Quirky Quail broke X, Y and Z and forced you to reinstall.
.
User avatar
Soul Singin'
 
Posts: 1607
Joined: 2008-12-21 07:02

Re: Should discussion of Ubuntu be censored?

Postby AdrianTM » 2010-04-10 07:13

Soul Singin' wrote:But America didn't take that approach. Instead, legislation was passed in 1964 to outlaw discrimination and racial segregation. Subsequent to that legislation were a large number of hate crimes laws. The result has been (in my opinion) a more tolerant country.
.

None of those laws stop the freedom of speech and the right (no matter how despicable) to say that black people are inferior or that white people are superior. Speech is not part of "hate crimes" (and don't get me started, I don't think that hate crime is a good idea, I think it smacks of thoughtcrime and thoughtcontrol).

And let's not make false analogies, it's one thing to talk silly things about an OS and another thing to talk idiotic things about a category of people who were enslaved at some point in history and discriminated afterwards.
Ubuntu hate is a mental derangement.
User avatar
AdrianTM
 
Posts: 2520
Joined: 2004-09-19 01:08

Re: Should discussion of Ubuntu be censored?

Postby llivv » 2010-04-10 07:34

here is a link to the censor wiki page
with a link to the censure wiki page at the bottom and maybe it needs a link to the licensure wiki too, but it's already past my bedtime
In memory of Ian Ashley Murdock (1973 - 2015) founder of the Debian project.
User avatar
llivv
 
Posts: 5484
Joined: 2007-02-14 18:10
Location: cold storage

Re: Should discussion of Ubuntu be censored?

Postby saulgoode » 2010-04-10 08:45

I answered "No". Though I don't always consider it unacceptable, 'tis extremely rare that censorship isn't a matter of the cure being worse than the disease.
Debugging is twice as hard as writing the code in the first place. Therefore, if you write the code as cleverly as possible, you are, by definition, not smart enough to debug it. -- Brian Kernighan
User avatar
saulgoode
 
Posts: 1545
Joined: 2007-10-22 11:34

Next

Return to Forum stuff & feedback

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 4 guests

fashionable