clarification:

Have something to say about forums.debian.net itself?

clarification:

Postby nadir » 2011-01-01 18:37

viewtopic.php?f=3&t=9196&start=2715#p341038

saulgoode wrote:
nadir wrote:That, the relation between strict rules and the anus (or anal fixation), could lead to a little talk about Freud.
But not here.
Perhaps here: "Studien zum autoritären Charakter" by T.Wiesengrund Adorno and M. Horkheimer and some others.

You are correct that this thread is not the appropriate place for such discussion. Please start a thread in Forum stuff and feedback if you wish to discuss the actions/philosophy/psychology of the Forum Staff.

You missed to quote that:
The one who thinks it is disgusting has got serious problems.
Also someone who is keen on strict rules.

Which makes clear that i can not have had the staff member in mind,
cause he said himself that he is not able to see the picture at all:
The image will not load for me but reportedly it is a disgusting pic


Which means that a post gets edited without being able to read it (or the part which is the "problem")
Which is odd.
And so odd, obviously, that i won't go into it any further.
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Re: clarification:

Postby AMLJ » 2011-01-01 18:53

I checked it on your profile nadir... Ain't lookin' disgusting in my opinion, and also, I think what was done is not right... The thread was about showing others what our desktop looks like...
One can have the desktop they want, and an image being disgusting doesn't look like a good reason for what was done...

No offense meant dear mods, etc., but disgusting has different meanings to different people... I really don't find that disgusting, and many people might not... As well...

Also, after seeing it, I've planned to change my wallpaper... Thanks nadir! :)
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Re: clarification:

Postby traveler » 2011-01-01 19:11

AMLJ wrote:I checked it on your profile nadir... Ain't lookin' disgusting in my opinion, and also, I think what was done is not right... The thread was about showing others what our desktop looks like...
One can have the desktop they want, and an image being disgusting doesn't look like a good reason for what was done...

No offense meant dear mods, etc., but disgusting has different meanings to different people... I really don't find that disgusting, and many people might not... As well...

Also, after seeing it, I've planned to change my wallpaper... Thanks nadir! :)


I think it should be the Default LMDE wallpaper. :lol:
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Re: clarification:

Postby AMLJ » 2011-01-01 19:12

traveler wrote:
AMLJ wrote:I checked it on your profile nadir... Ain't lookin' disgusting in my opinion, and also, I think what was done is not right... The thread was about showing others what our desktop looks like...
One can have the desktop they want, and an image being disgusting doesn't look like a good reason for what was done...

No offense meant dear mods, etc., but disgusting has different meanings to different people... I really don't find that disgusting, and many people might not... As well...

Also, after seeing it, I've planned to change my wallpaper... Thanks nadir! :)


I think it should be the Default LMDE wallpaper. :lol:

:lol: :lol:
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Re: clarification:

Postby MeanDean » 2011-01-01 21:45


*******
Post edited by Absent Minded:
I have disabled the link in this post until it's content can be verified. The image will not load for me but reportedly it is a disgusting pic and should not be linked to from this forum. Once one of the other staff can verify it's content I/we will make a final decision.


WOW....all I can say is wow..........slowly but surely......more and more like every other forum out there....

the same old road......same ol same ol.....

I thought sure we had some admins/mods that could identify a slippery slope and not even start down it....sometimes I surprise myself about how mistaken I can be about things....



stop dicking around and get on with it already......the longer it takes to turn the forum into complete crap the more painful it is....torture really....
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Re: clarification:

Postby jheaton5 » 2011-01-01 22:09

@nadir
I don't understand what all the fuss is about. I'm looking at the screen shot now in elinks and don't see anything untoward. :)
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Re: clarification:

Postby JohnDeere630 » 2011-01-01 22:09

MeanDean wrote:


stop dicking around and get on with it already......the longer it takes to turn the forum into complete crap the more painful it is....torture really....


Ya, I must be missing something here...I thought that thread was for posting screenshots of one's desktop, which Nadir did. Personally, I would not choose a picture of dog shit for my desktop, as someone said, if I wanted shit on my computer, I would just run windows. But, what the heck; if someone wants that on their desktop, who am I to say it is wrong? I do agree that profanity, racial/religious/sexual-orientation slurs and graphic sexual images have no place here, not that they offend me, but because there may be some younger members here, and, oh, BTW, those ARE the rules! but Nadir's image was none of those things. Heaven knows I have stepped in enough & hit some big juicy piles with the lawnmower & it pissed me off, but I was not offended... :lol: Now, if it had been cat crap, then I would have been grievously offended, maybe even challenged nadir to a duel of honor in Abraham Lincoln's inimitable style: Frozen horse turds at 5 paces.... :roll:
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Re: clarification:

Postby nadir » 2011-01-01 22:41

The one hand: it sure feels good that my wallpaper is not that bad. Bad, perhaps, but not that bad.

The other hand: The post got edited without being able to see the picture. That would not be ok even if the shot would be disgusting.


-------------------
To say it plain:
It is better to do nothing than to do the wrong thing. Do something with the only purpose to do something is not good.
If i want to do "something" i do the dishes.
Someone reports. So what? Shall i start reporting everything i don't like too? And everyone else should do that too?



I guess in the long run it doesn't matter. Besides the point MeanDean has brought up (and as far i see he even missed some of the other edits).
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Re: clarification:

Postby traveler » 2011-01-01 22:48

nadir wrote:The one hand: it sure feels good that my wallpaper is not that bad. Bad, perhaps, but not that bad.

The other hand: The post got edited without being able to see the picture. That would not be ok even if the shot would be disgusting.


-------------------
To say it plain:
It is better to do nothing than to do the wrong thing. Do something with the only purpose to do something is not good.
If i want to do "something" i do the dishes.
Someone reports. So what? Shall i start reporting everything i don't like too? And everyone else should do that too?



I guess in the long run it doesn't matter. Besides the point MeanDean has brought up (and as far i see he even missed some of the other edits).


In all fairness, AM didn't exactly make it difficult to fix the link. But, censorship without review is never right. Now that we know his connection is slow, we could report all the derivative scrots and maybe we wouldn't be subjected to such profanity in the future. Think of the children...
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Re: clarification:

Postby saulgoode » 2011-01-01 23:42

nadir wrote:You missed to quote that:
The one who thinks it is disgusting has got serious problems.
Also someone who is keen on strict rules.

Which makes clear that i can not have had the staff member in mind, ...

I was (and am) aware that the direct object of your criticism as worded was whoever had reported your screenshot, not the Forum Staff; however, the Staff might reasonably be inferred as a target of your criticism as it is they who are responsible for administration of any "strict rules" on these forums.

That is not to say that criticism of Staff actions or forum policy is unwarranted or even unwelcome, merely that it did not belong in that thread. I truly appreciate that you moved the discussion here so that the thread on users' screenshots of their desktops might continue.

nadir wrote:... cause he said himself that he is not able to see the picture at all:
The image will not load for me but reportedly it is a disgusting pic

For what it's worth, I viewed the image when the post was reported and found it distasteful, but not necessarily "disgusting". Nonetheless, I do not consider good taste to be a prerequisite for material posted on these forums and I did not (and would not have) edited your post.

nadir wrote:Which means that a post gets edited without being able to read it (or the part which is the "problem")
Which is odd.
And so odd, obviously, that i won't go into it any further.

Absent Minded edited your post apparently based upon the assessment of the person who reported it. This might be owing to a lapse in judgment on Absent Minded's part, or perhaps it is that Absent Minded does not ascribe to you the same degree of trust as he does the reporter of the image. If you feel you are deserving of a greater amount of trust, perhaps some introspection upon your recent posting behavior would be beneficial.
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Re: clarification:

Postby Ook » 2011-01-01 23:54

I show people my bear scat pictures all the time. (They donn't make good backgrounds, not having the photographic flare that the image in question does. But I keep a few of them in the "MyPics" section of wallpaper rotation.) Never had a clue I was being disgusting. Now i feel a little embarrassed.

I don't think it is censorship though if you can easily reconstruct the link.
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Re: clarification:

Postby nadir » 2011-01-02 00:03

@saulgoode.
First: thanks.

Some thoughts:
That is not to say that criticism of Staff actions or forum policy is unwarranted or even unwelcome, merely that it did not belong in that thread. I truly appreciate that you moved the discussion here so that the thread on users' screenshots of their desktops might continue.

No problem, i realized it myself. You asked, so i did it.
It just happens (Something gets posted, one word, the other word, suddenly it doesn't fit no more where it is ...or not at all).


perhaps some introspection upon your recent posting behavior would be beneficial.

I think i know what you mean (and, to a certain degree, agree). And some of them could have been edited.
On the other hand: check the first three pages of my recent posts (yup, lots in screenshot-thread, and not all has been nice).


or perhaps it is that Absent Minded does not ascribe to you the same degree of trust as he does the reporter of the image.

It might be an idea to re-think that. It looks like he or she has not earned it.
(the reporter should also re-think his behaviour, cause Absent Minded doesn't look very good now. It is not very fair to let someone run into that).

I still think it is not ok to edit posts from what one has heard (-aka a report).
Seen that way it doesn't matter if i am trustworthy or not.

I am not so sure if that was clear. I tried it.
greetings and all.
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Re: clarification:

Postby saulgoode » 2011-01-02 01:12

nadir wrote:
or perhaps it is that Absent Minded does not ascribe to you the same degree of trust as he does the reporter of the image.

It might be an idea to re-think that. It looks like he or she has not earned it.
(the reporter should also re-think his behaviour, cause Absent Minded doesn't look very good now. It is not very fair to let someone run into that).

A fair comment; and whether consciously or not, such re-evaluation will undoubted take place.

nadir wrote:I still think it is not ok to edit posts from what one has heard (-aka a report).
Seen that way it doesn't matter if i am trustworthy or not.

Granted, directly examining the evidence in any dispute is preferable; but when the evidence is not available it is still necessary to make a decision. To quote a famous 20th century philosopher*, "If you choose not to decide, you still have made a choice". Leaving a possibly offensive image on the board had to be weighed against the negative specter of "censorship" and a judgment made.

We are all free to decide for ourselves whether we feel a correct judgment was made in this particular case but in fairness to Absent Minded, he was unable to view the image (and thus had to make presumptions based on recent events in that thread and the people involved) and chose to take rather minimal action -- he did not delete the link but instead left it in a state most members here could readily make usable. Maybe when he has a chance to revisit the forums he will decide that the image is not unacceptable for the forums. Regardless, I applaud the fact that he chose not to lock the thread (apparently one of the longest running threads on the forum), despite having had to step in on multiple occasions recently to keep things on track.


* Geddy Lee, songwriter and lead singer of the Canadian rock band Rush (OK, maybe not a philosopher, but he is famous :) )
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Re: clarification:

Postby Absent Minded » 2011-01-02 05:34

First off thanks for addressing this here. I have un-obfuscated the link but left it in a usable state. It will just not be fallowed by a search engine when the forum is scanned for content.

I do appreciate knowing everyone’s take on this. Before deciding to finely obfuscate the link I did ask the staff member I thought most likely to respond in a timely fashion to verify what was reported. When I did not receive a response and had more complaints I decided it must be more serious than I originally figured it was. At which point I edited the post, obfuscating the link but not enough to make it so others that really wanted to see it for themselves couldn't do so. Now that I have been able to verify it is not something horrid or obscene as I had been partly lead to believe I have left the link. As I stated though it is not clickable as I don't believe it is something the search engines should be picking up and associating with this forum. The post was made after all in protest to another member and really served no other purpose from my vantage point.

Nadir, you always told me that I needed to treat you like I would any other member regardless of the status of our friendship. I am sorry that it was your toes that were stepped on but I believe that under the circumstances I did the right thing. I tried to ask you what the picture was and you didn't answer but to say it was not offensive to you. That left things up for a very wide area of interpretation. Had it been something serious (which I am glad it wasn't) it shouldn't have been left there. I will leave you with this... you have no idea to what extent I have been there for you at times. Although I have bent no rules for you, I have defended you a plenty. I guess you can do with that as you wish.

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Re: clarification:

Postby julian67 » 2011-01-02 06:45

Image
Wisdom from my inbox: "do not mock at your pottenocy"
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