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Why was my thread removed?
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Why was my thread removed?
I am asking here because no moderator contacted me to provide notice or explanation.
Ahtiga Saraz
Le peuple debout contre les tyrans! De l'audace, encore de l'audace, toujours l'audace!
Le peuple debout contre les tyrans! De l'audace, encore de l'audace, toujours l'audace!
Re: Why was my thread removed?
I don't believe the moderators would contact you if they chose to remove your thread. It would have to basically be spam or extremely inflammatory to be considered for removal. What was it about?
Re: Why was my thread removed?
I read (part of) it. Very interesting.
It was about tor and censorship...
(Who said irony is dead )
It was about tor and censorship...
(Who said irony is dead )
Re: Why was my thread removed?
Paranoid, political, conspiracy stuff on a grand scale that went on forever. "They" may be out to get us in 1000 ways but worrying about it isn't going to change anything except make us miserable in the here and now. And since the world is already unreliable, fraught with suffering and not under our control it doesn't make a whole lot of difference one way or the other to me.kevmitch wrote:What was it about?
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Re: Why was my thread removed?
It was calledkevmitch wrote:I don't believe the moderators would contact you if they chose to remove your thread. It would have to basically be spam or extremely inflammatory to be considered for removal. What was it about?
It was probably removed as it was deemed to political. http://forums.debian.net/viewtopic.php?f=11&t=10653Human Rights, Tor, and State Sponsored Surveillance
The following might get your post REMOVED
- Advertising/ Spamming
- Obviously racist/ sexist/ hateful content
- Obviously political/ religious content
- Obvious pornographic content
I didn't think it paranoid, far from it. It was well argued with much to back it up. Whether writing about it is going to change anything, only time will tell. Not your cup of tea maybe, and while you may have given up to those that control you many have not.golinux wrote:Paranoid, political, conspiracy stuff on a grand scale that went on forever. "They" may be out to get us in 1000 ways but worrying about it isn't going to change anything except make us miserable in the here and now. And since the world is already unreliable, fraught with suffering and not under our control it doesn't make a whole lot of difference one way or the other to me.kevmitch wrote:What was it about?
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Re: Why was my thread removed?
@Loomx, oswaldkelso,
Thank you for the "interesting", "well-argued". If anyone kept a copy and is willing to PM it to me, my work might not be lost.
[EDIT 1900 UTC: Someone has sent me a copy. Many thanks!]
@golinux,
A few decades ago my attitude closely resembled yours, and life was somewhat less impossible. From my personal experience, coming under personal attack by the secret police can alter such an attitude in a heartbeat. I hope you will consider following some of the links I provided (if you kept a copy) and then read https://secure.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/ ... _they_came and then decide whether you wish to modify your position.
"A time comes when silence is betrayal" Martin Luther King
Thank you for the "interesting", "well-argued". If anyone kept a copy and is willing to PM it to me, my work might not be lost.
[EDIT 1900 UTC: Someone has sent me a copy. Many thanks!]
@golinux,
A few decades ago my attitude closely resembled yours, and life was somewhat less impossible. From my personal experience, coming under personal attack by the secret police can alter such an attitude in a heartbeat. I hope you will consider following some of the links I provided (if you kept a copy) and then read https://secure.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/ ... _they_came and then decide whether you wish to modify your position.
The moderator who removed it, whoever he/she was, has not deigned to give their point of view, but from my point of view, I was trying to discuss the little known hazards of using Tor, something which I presume many of us do at least occasionally, and also discuss what I regard as the misbehavior of companies like Cisco with which many sysadmins deal on a daily basis in their work. I thought that would interest other Linux users. Apparently I am not the only one who thinks Cisco (and American prosecutors) are behaving rather badly on the international stage:It was probably removed as it was deemed to political.
- Nick Farrell, "Cisco blasted for arranging arrest of whistleblower", Techeye, 22 Jul 2011
http://www.techeye.net/business/cisco-b ... stleblower - Ian Mulgrew, "A pound of flesh: how Cisco's "unmitigated gall" derailed one man's life", Ars Technica, 21 July 2011 http://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/news ... s-life.ars
Spycos like Gamma Group, Cisco, secret police agencies.... these are powerful entities with a global reach. So I suppose I should expect them to change me long before anything changes in the wider world. I spend my days listening for the sound of the midnight knock on the door... or an incoming Hellfire missile. In the mean time, I can dream that even American war criminals will one day face open trial in the International Criminal Court.Whether writing about it is going to change anything, only time will tell.
"A time comes when silence is betrayal" Martin Luther King
Last edited by Ahtiga Saraz on 2011-07-22 18:50, edited 1 time in total.
Ahtiga Saraz
Le peuple debout contre les tyrans! De l'audace, encore de l'audace, toujours l'audace!
Le peuple debout contre les tyrans! De l'audace, encore de l'audace, toujours l'audace!
Re: Why was my thread removed?
Even this board is dictated by the personal and public political views of the owner and the Debian organization. Emulating the behavior of debianuserforums.org and creating either an abyss or a truly off topic section would be better.
Let my desire and hope surpass my expectations;
And give me the strength to persevere through doubt.
Grant me the wisdom to exceed my bounds.
Let my eyes always see through the dream fog of childhood,
so that every moment may be treasured.
And give me the strength to persevere through doubt.
Grant me the wisdom to exceed my bounds.
Let my eyes always see through the dream fog of childhood,
so that every moment may be treasured.
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What owner? What publically expressed views?
Links? I don't know what you are talking about. Possibly I should.personal and public political views ... owner
Ahtiga Saraz
Le peuple debout contre les tyrans! De l'audace, encore de l'audace, toujours l'audace!
Le peuple debout contre les tyrans! De l'audace, encore de l'audace, toujours l'audace!
Re: Why was my thread removed?
You can ask craigevil about what I am referring to.
The Debian Social Contract is a political document. People will follow it with religious fervor.
Any post that is removed is done so based upon that moderator's or administrator's personal interpretation of the board rules. No human has the ability to be completely objective and honest without causing self harm.
The Debian Social Contract is a political document. People will follow it with religious fervor.
Any post that is removed is done so based upon that moderator's or administrator's personal interpretation of the board rules. No human has the ability to be completely objective and honest without causing self harm.
Last edited by sossego on 2011-07-22 19:16, edited 1 time in total.
Let my desire and hope surpass my expectations;
And give me the strength to persevere through doubt.
Grant me the wisdom to exceed my bounds.
Let my eyes always see through the dream fog of childhood,
so that every moment may be treasured.
And give me the strength to persevere through doubt.
Grant me the wisdom to exceed my bounds.
Let my eyes always see through the dream fog of childhood,
so that every moment may be treasured.
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Can I?
Looks like craigevil has disabled PMs.
Speaking of social-networking security, is there something about PMs at this board which you know and I do not?
(I know that moderators can read any PM they want, so if it's that, I already know.)
Speaking of social-networking security, is there something about PMs at this board which you know and I do not?
(I know that moderators can read any PM they want, so if it's that, I already know.)
Ahtiga Saraz
Le peuple debout contre les tyrans! De l'audace, encore de l'audace, toujours l'audace!
Le peuple debout contre les tyrans! De l'audace, encore de l'audace, toujours l'audace!
Re: Why was my thread removed?
The disabling of private messages is to prevent retaliation due to personal ignorance- all are included on this statement. In doing such, craigevil and the others prevent people from representing and defending themselves. Humans have a tendency to disagree and fight; this is normal. Censoring others and creating a constricting environment reflects the ideas of Huxley's Brave New World.
Let my desire and hope surpass my expectations;
And give me the strength to persevere through doubt.
Grant me the wisdom to exceed my bounds.
Let my eyes always see through the dream fog of childhood,
so that every moment may be treasured.
And give me the strength to persevere through doubt.
Grant me the wisdom to exceed my bounds.
Let my eyes always see through the dream fog of childhood,
so that every moment may be treasured.
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Re: Why was my thread removed?
Simple enough:
The following might get your post REMOVED
- Advertising/ Spamming
- Obviously racist/ sexist/ hateful content
- Obviously political/ religious content
- Obvious pornographic content
Go blog about it instead of posting it on forums.
Technically it wasn't removed it was moved to Spam. It was a mile long and while it was about Tor it was more about the political problems than the technical and as such doesn't belong on this forum.
The following might get your post REMOVED
- Advertising/ Spamming
- Obviously racist/ sexist/ hateful content
- Obviously political/ religious content
- Obvious pornographic content
Go blog about it instead of posting it on forums.
Technically it wasn't removed it was moved to Spam. It was a mile long and while it was about Tor it was more about the political problems than the technical and as such doesn't belong on this forum.
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My errant thread
"Spam"? Is that a nonpublic subforum at DUF? I can't find it.Technically it wasn't removed it was moved to Spam.
Ahtiga Saraz
Le peuple debout contre les tyrans! De l'audace, encore de l'audace, toujours l'audace!
Le peuple debout contre les tyrans! De l'audace, encore de l'audace, toujours l'audace!
Re: My errant thread
Correct, it can be seen by staff only.Ahtiga Saraz wrote: "Spam"? Is that a nonpublic subforum at DUF? I can't find it.
Re: Why was my thread removed?
I don't think you really understood what I was trying to say. External controls may limit a certain kind of freedom. But the mind is limitless. Ultimately the only 'control' that matters is in your own head. That is where bondage or liberation arise regardless of external circumstances. That being said, I am not exactly 'uninvolved' in trying to stem the madness that is overtaking us. I just do it with a great deal of detachment.oswaldkelso wrote:. . . while you may have given up to those that control you many have not.golinux wrote:"They" may be out to get us in 1000 ways but worrying about it isn't going to change anything except make us miserable in the here and now. And since the world is already unreliable, fraught with suffering and not under our control it doesn't make a whole lot of difference one way or the other to me.
May the FORK be with you!
Re: Why was my thread removed?
Oh please. I live in a geographical location whose authorities deem the word pr0xy evil and thus prevent me from downloading anything whose name contains those four letters in sequence, including the dependencies of Gnome and KDE, thus forcing me to abort installation, use an http pr0xy, manually download the file, rename the file to it's correct name, manually stick it in /var/cache/apt/archives/ and continue the install.craigevil wrote:while it was about Tor it was more about the political problems than the technical and as such doesn't belong on this forum.
Discussing that and the workaround is obviously political yet is preventing me from installing Debian normally - obviously technical.
Just about anything can be made to be "obviously" anything. Why do we need security? To protect ourselves from intruders. Like who? Governments. Thread deleted - obviously political content.
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@ moderators: can I try again?
I don't come here often enough to know, so please forgive me for asking an elementary question about this forum: do the moderators have colorized names in the sidebar, like craigevil? I am finding it difficult to keep track of who is a moderator in this discussion, and who is not.
@ Mr James:
Yes, agreed, sometimes discussing a technical problem (or security problem) requires mention of political issues; we have provided two examples in this thread.
@ craigevil:
What is one supposed to do in such a case?
I think it is important to publicize the pervasive surveillance of Tor traffic by dozens of private spycos allied with various national intelligence agencies, since so many of us feel we have no alternative to Tor in order to use the internet at all. And these days, never going on-line is virtually synonymous with not living.
I think that sometimes some slack should be cut. Maybe we can meet in the middle? With a little help from a moderator, I might be able to find some way to discuss pervasive surveillance of Tor traffic by various parties, while avoiding as far as possible any attempt to explain the rather complicated political background issues which have given rise to such surveillance. Could I get permission to try again?
@ Mr James:
Yes, agreed, sometimes discussing a technical problem (or security problem) requires mention of political issues; we have provided two examples in this thread.
@ craigevil:
What is one supposed to do in such a case?
I think it is important to publicize the pervasive surveillance of Tor traffic by dozens of private spycos allied with various national intelligence agencies, since so many of us feel we have no alternative to Tor in order to use the internet at all. And these days, never going on-line is virtually synonymous with not living.
I think that sometimes some slack should be cut. Maybe we can meet in the middle? With a little help from a moderator, I might be able to find some way to discuss pervasive surveillance of Tor traffic by various parties, while avoiding as far as possible any attempt to explain the rather complicated political background issues which have given rise to such surveillance. Could I get permission to try again?
Ahtiga Saraz
Le peuple debout contre les tyrans! De l'audace, encore de l'audace, toujours l'audace!
Le peuple debout contre les tyrans! De l'audace, encore de l'audace, toujours l'audace!
Re: @ moderators: can I try again?
http://forums.debian.net/memberlist.php?mode=leadersAhtiga Saraz wrote:I don't come here often enough to know, so please forgive me for asking an elementary question about this forum: do the moderators have colorized names in the sidebar, like craigevil? I am finding it difficult to keep track of who is a moderator in this discussion, and who is not.
http://forums.debian.net/viewtopic.php?f=30&t=10653Ahtiga Saraz wrote:What is one supposed to do in such a case?
I think that sometimes some slack should be cut. Maybe we can meet in the middle? Could I get permission to try again?
11. If you feel like your post/ thread has been locked, edited or even removed in error please contact the moderator team via e-mail at team@forums.debian.net.
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All in our head?
@ 4D696B65:
Thank you, those links are very helpful, and I have bookmarked them.
@ golinux:
If it would not be "too political" for me to recommend some books which I think should interest anyone interested in the history of American slavery c. 1776:
Thank you, those links are very helpful, and I have bookmarked them.
@ golinux:
Sounds like you have thought about this, so I want to make sure I do not misunderstand you. If it would not be "too political" to ask: are you saying that slavery or freedom is a matter of attitude? I don't think Frederick Douglass would agree with that at all!Ultimately the only 'control' that matters is in your own head. That is where bondage or liberation arise regardless of external circumstances.
If it would not be "too political" for me to recommend some books which I think should interest anyone interested in the history of American slavery c. 1776:
- Simon Schama, Rough Crossing
- Rhys Isaac, Landon Carter's Uneasy Kingdom
- Andrew Levy, The First Emancipator
If you'd like to elaborate, I am curious.That being said, I am not exactly 'uninvolved' in trying to stem the madness that is overtaking us. I just do it with a great deal of detachment.
Ahtiga Saraz
Le peuple debout contre les tyrans! De l'audace, encore de l'audace, toujours l'audace!
Le peuple debout contre les tyrans! De l'audace, encore de l'audace, toujours l'audace!
Re: All in our head?
Obviously, oppression in any form is unacceptable.Ahtiga Saraz wrote:@ golinux:. . . are you saying that slavery or freedom is a matter of attitude?Ultimately the only 'control' that matters is in your own head. That is where bondage or liberation arise regardless of external circumstances.
However, you misinterpreted the word 'bondage' as 'slavery' which was not at all what I had intended. I used the word 'bondage' because the mind 'binds' to pleasant or unpleasant objects usually with attachment or aversion. That knee jerk reaction 'binds' the mind to external stimuli which are ultimately out of our control. A well-trained mind can remain unruffled by the whiplash of emotion, ie. mental suffering, regardless of extreme mental or physical circumstances.
No Howard Zinn or Noam Chomsky?Ahtiga Saraz wrote:If it would not be "too political" for me to recommend some books . . .
Have been trying to get GMOs out of the food supply since the early 90s and network around the globe to do so. Also active in local issues such as water rights and/or degraded quality of life stemming from irresponsible development and/or corporate negligence etc. One person cannot do everything . . . only one small part as the planet and civil society spiral into extinction.Ahtiga Saraz wrote:If you'd like to elaborate, I am curious.That being said, I am not exactly 'uninvolved' in trying to stem the madness that is overtaking us. I just do it with a great deal of detachment.
Last edited by golinux on 2011-07-25 04:05, edited 2 times in total.
May the FORK be with you!