linux-image-4.9.0-rt-amd64 and nvidia-driver

Help with issues regarding installation of Debian

linux-image-4.9.0-rt-amd64 and nvidia-driver

Postby hal9k » 2018-09-15 13:47

Hi,

i am trying to install

- debian 9.5 using the preempt_rt kernel (4.9.0-8)
- on an ASROCK J4005 board
- with a nvidia GT1030.

Installing debian 9.5 works without any major complaints.
Setting up the image and headers of the preempt_rt kernel is fine (using the metapackage).
The system reboots - it's all good.
I am using apt-get update at this point, before trying to install the nvidia driver suggested by nvidia-detect.

Then, when i try to install the nvidia-driver package (384.130, dkms) it complaint's about me using a realtime kernel
and compilation of the kernel fails (installing the nvidia-driver without realtime does work - just to make sure).

Currently i am using standard stretch packages - no backports.

As reading about this on the net (for the last couple of days) left me quite confused,
i would like to ask if someone can help and clarify things for me:

In the old days it seems, there was a patch for each version of the driver which fixed things.
Then, at some point in time, there was no need for the patch at all and the debian internal nvidia-driver took care of things.
Currently, the (stable) nvidia-driver (384.130) does not support the realtime kernel.
There is a bug being mentioned for a slightly earlier version that won't be fixed, or maybe it's just me doing something wrong.

Does anyone know of a current combination of debian preempt_rt kernel and nvidia-driver that does work
(the nvidia driver version being at least 384.130)?

Is using the nvidia driver (from their website) an option (worst case ...)?

Keeping things stable would be nice.

Thanks, Timo
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Re: linux-image-4.9.0-rt-amd64 and nvidia-driver

Postby bw123 » 2018-09-15 14:03

bug is tagged as won't fix on 384,
https://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugrepo ... bug=883793
seems to be a problem for newer versions also.
https://duckduckgo.com/html/?q=nvidia+real-time+preempt
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Re: linux-image-4.9.0-rt-amd64 and nvidia-driver

Postby None1975 » 2018-09-15 14:07

To use the standard Debian kernel is not a solution?
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Re: linux-image-4.9.0-rt-amd64 and nvidia-driver

Postby hal9k » 2018-09-15 14:17

Thanks for the replies.

This system is meant to be running LinuxCNC, therefore i do need the realtime kernel.

I would rather use another graphics card instead as dedicated graphics seems to improve latency.

nvidia .. what Linus said ;)
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Re: linux-image-4.9.0-rt-amd64 and nvidia-driver

Postby stevepusser » 2018-09-15 17:16

People doing audio work have successfully used the low-latency Liquorix kernel instead, which will build Nvidia drivers, but I don't know if it will meet your CNC RT requirements. If you're using Stable, I maintain backports of the Liquorix kernel for Jessie, Stretch, and Ubuntu 14.04: https://techpatterns.com/forums/about2615.html

You'll need the Nvidia drivers from Stretch backports to build with the 4.18.X kernels.
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Re: linux-image-4.9.0-rt-amd64 and nvidia-driver

Postby hal9k » 2018-09-15 17:45

Liquorix sounds interesting, thanks.

Not sure if it will work, but it's worth to try.
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Re: linux-image-4.9.0-rt-amd64 and nvidia-driver

Postby sunrat » 2018-09-15 22:47

The Liquorix kernel is good for audio but not sure about CNC. RT kernels are generally difficult or impossible to use with Nvidia drivers.
Support for Pascal cards (which includes GT1030) was not added to the default Nouveau drivers until kernel 4.14 and appears to still not include reclocking or 3D acceleration although that's probably not needed for CNC. There doesn't appear to be an RT kernel available for Stretch later than 4.9.
There is a 4.18 RT kernel available for Testing if you're game to try running Testing. If it works and you don't need to connect to internet/network, you could ignore the usual testing update roundabout.
https://packages.debian.org/buster/linux-image-rt-amd64
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Re: linux-image-4.9.0-rt-amd64 and nvidia-driver

Postby debiman » 2018-09-16 06:25

hal9k wrote:This system is meant to be running LinuxCNC, therefore i do need the realtime kernel.
i recently stumbled upon this:
https://forum.linuxcnc.org/9-installing ... n-debian-9
(maybe in one of your other threads)
RT seems to be the correct choice.

I would rather use another graphics card instead as dedicated graphics seems to improve latency.
so, aren't you saying here that you don't really need the nvidia card?
why do you insist on using it then?
doesn't the mobo have onboard graphics?
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Re: linux-image-4.9.0-rt-amd64 and nvidia-driver

Postby hal9k » 2018-09-16 10:31

after some sleep, i set up a system using debian buster.

Nouveau detects the nvidia card (just required some firmware) and the rt image installs fine.

This might be a good place to start, knowing it will be stable at some point.
The nouveau driver seems to be a good choice in the long run.

@debiman

i stumbled upon that link too.

Both, the internal intel gpu (uhd600) and the nvidia approach (using nouveau) require a newer kernel to run, buster (currently 4.18) seems to work.
Using the internal GPU is my fallback option for now.

I will compare both scenarios (using the intel gpu vs. nvidia/nouveau) as soon as i have linuxcnc compiled - just might take some time to do so :)

At this point i can't say for sure which one (internal vs dedicated gpu) is the better choice (in terms of worst case latency).
That's why i would like to try both options and then decide on what works best for me.
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Re: linux-image-4.9.0-rt-amd64 and nvidia-driver

Postby stevepusser » 2018-09-16 20:30

Part of the problem seems to be your shiny new 2018 8th-gen Intel hardware and Stretch's aging 2016 kernel and drivers.

You can get it working correctly with updates from stretch-backports for Mesa, kernels (currently the same in stretch-backports as in testing) and firmware packages (my 8th-gen MSI laptop works well with these now, but it was pretty hectic for a while back in May), but the easiest path is probably to stick with testing.
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Re: linux-image-4.9.0-rt-amd64 and nvidia-driver

Postby hal9k » 2018-09-16 21:29

yeah, i guess using an older generation of board would make things easier, but this way i am learning quite a bit and Buster seems pretty stable for a 'testing' branch.

The intel gpu actually works out of the box and has lower latency than the nvidia/nouveau approach for now - nouveau still might need some polishing.
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Re: linux-image-4.9.0-rt-amd64 and nvidia-driver

Postby sunrat » 2018-09-16 23:35

stevepusser wrote:... but the easiest path is probably to stick with testing.

There is no recent RT kernel in backports which is why I suggested testing.
The downside is that it is testing, and liable to break with upgrades at any time. Be very careful of what packages upgrade proposes to remove, and abort if you're unsure. It will usually become safe again after a short time.

hal9k wrote:The intel gpu actually works out of the box and has lower latency than the nvidia/nouveau approach for now - nouveau still might need some polishing.

Interesting, thanks for sharing that.
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