Mini Tutorial Using Netbooks with Debian

Help with issues regarding installation of Debian

Mini Tutorial Using Netbooks with Debian

Postby thmtrxhsu » 2020-05-09 05:25

Anyone who has downloaded Debian likely has view this page:
https://www.debian.org/distrib/
Now maybe, it's just me, but I despise the formatting on the page.

Now you may have come across this link:
https://cdimage.debian.org/debian-cd/current/amd64/iso-cd/
And naturally neither the netinstall nor XFCE version can connect to the wireless network.

So rational would have you download the same version with the non-free firmware at this link:
https://cdimage.debian.org/images/unofficial/non-free/images-including-firmware/10.3.0+nonfree/amd64/iso-cd/
Only to find that once again, your wireless does not work; just wow.

Conclusion, the isos are the former links are garbage insofar as wireless connectivity is concerned.

And yet everything worked with Tails and Ubuntu Distros, so something was amiss. There had to be a common base that all of these "successful" distros used, and it was at this link:
https://cdimage.debian.org/images/unofficial/non-free/images-including-firmware/10.3.0-live+nonfree/amd64/iso-hybrid/

That link possesses the "debian-live-10.3.0-amd64-standard+nonfree.iso" after which those aforementioned distros are based off.
Naturally, adjust the link to your cpu architecture.

In case, your wondering that standard iso ships without a desktop, it is literally the gnome backbone that makes everything work. Naturally, if you could do a netinstall you could have a much leaner and less gnome-dependent backbone if you wanted. But as you are stuck with a netbook and wanting to use Debian, then that ISO or any of the other ISOs at that "nonfree iso-hybrid" link, may be your only choice. Anyhow it's easier to deconstruct this Debian standard (or disable memory consuming components) than to construct a Debian netinstall as you will probably need over 80% of the packages short of using a Debian Installation for the sole purpose of a terminally driven scientific calculator; might as well use tinycore then.
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Re: Mini Tutorial Using Netbooks with Debian

Postby Head_on_a_Stick » 2020-05-09 11:23

thmtrxhsu wrote:So rational would have you download the same version with the non-free firmware at this link:
https://cdimage.debian.org/images/unofficial/non-free/images-including-firmware/10.3.0+nonfree/amd64/iso-cd/
Only to find that once again, your wireless does not work; just wow.

That image works just fine on all of my machines and it does contain firmware:
Code: Select all
empty@E485 ~ % sudo mount firmware-10.3.0-amd64-netinst.iso /mnt
mount: /mnt: WARNING: device write-protected, mounted read-only.
empty@E485 ~ % ls /mnt/firmware
amd64-microcode_3.20181128.1_amd64.deb
atmel-firmware_1.3-4_all.deb
bluez-firmware_1.2-4_all.deb
dahdi-firmware-nonfree_2.11.1.0.20170917-1_all.deb
firmware-amd-graphics_20190114-2_all.deb
firmware-ath9k-htc_1.4.0-97-g75b3e59+dfsg-3_all.deb
firmware-atheros_20190114-2_all.deb
firmware-b43legacy-installer_019-4_all.deb
firmware-b43-installer_019-4_all.deb
firmware-bnx2x_20190114-2_all.deb
firmware-bnx2_20190114-2_all.deb
firmware-brcm80211_20190114-2_all.deb
firmware-cavium_20190114-2_all.deb
firmware-intelwimax_20190114-2_all.deb
firmware-intel-sound_20190114-2_all.deb
firmware-ipw2x00_20190114-2_all.deb
firmware-ivtv_20190114-2_all.deb
firmware-iwlwifi_20190114-2_all.deb
firmware-libertas_20190114-2_all.deb
firmware-linux-free_3.4_all.deb
firmware-linux-nonfree_20190114-2_all.deb
firmware-misc-nonfree_20190114-2_all.deb
firmware-myricom_20190114-2_all.deb
firmware-netronome_20190114-2_all.deb
firmware-netxen_20190114-2_all.deb
firmware-qcom-media_20190114-2_all.deb
firmware-qlogic_20190114-2_all.deb
firmware-realtek_20190114-2_all.deb
firmware-samsung_20190114-2_all.deb
firmware-siano_20190114-2_all.deb
firmware-ti-connectivity_20190114-2_all.deb
firmware-zd1211_1.5-6_all.deb
hdmi2usb-fx2-firmware_0.0.0~git20151225-2_all.deb
intel-microcode_3.20191115.2~deb10u1_amd64.deb
empty@E485 ~ %

thmtrxhsu wrote:Conclusion, the isos are the former links are garbage insofar as wireless connectivity is concerned.

My conclusion is that you're a clueless idiot who likes to post uninformed nonsense on these boards.

thmtrxhsu wrote:And yet everything worked with Tails and Ubuntu Distros, so something was amiss. There had to be a common base that all of these "successful" distros used, and it was at this link:
https://cdimage.debian.org/images/unofficial/non-free/images-including-firmware/10.3.0-live+nonfree/amd64/iso-hybrid/

That link possesses the "debian-live-10.3.0-amd64-standard+nonfree.iso" after which those aforementioned distros are based off.

No, Ubuntu is not "based off" the Debian buster live image :roll:

But those images do contain some extra firmware when compared to the netinstall image:
Code: Select all
empty@E485 ~ % diff -u firmware_{netinstall,live}.txt
--- firmware_netinstall.txt     2020-05-09 12:51:51.950597707 +0100
+++ firmware_live.txt   2020-05-09 12:52:28.155098316 +0100
@@ -2,11 +2,13 @@
 atmel-firmware_1.3-4_all.deb
 bluez-firmware_1.2-4_all.deb
 dahdi-firmware-nonfree_2.11.1.0.20170917-1_all.deb
+dns323-firmware-tools_0.7.3-1_all.deb
+expeyes-firmware-dev_4.4.4+dfsg-4_all.deb
+firmware-adi_20190114-2_all.deb
 firmware-amd-graphics_20190114-2_all.deb
+firmware-ath9k-htc-dbgsym_1.4.0-97-g75b3e59+dfsg-3_all.deb
 firmware-ath9k-htc_1.4.0-97-g75b3e59+dfsg-3_all.deb
 firmware-atheros_20190114-2_all.deb
-firmware-b43legacy-installer_019-4_all.deb
-firmware-b43-installer_019-4_all.deb
 firmware-bnx2x_20190114-2_all.deb
 firmware-bnx2_20190114-2_all.deb
 firmware-brcm80211_20190114-2_all.deb
@@ -19,16 +21,26 @@
 firmware-libertas_20190114-2_all.deb
 firmware-linux-free_3.4_all.deb
 firmware-linux-nonfree_20190114-2_all.deb
+firmware-linux_20190114-2_all.deb
+firmware-microbit-micropython-doc_1.0.1-1_all.deb
+firmware-microbit-micropython_1.0.1-1_all.deb
 firmware-misc-nonfree_20190114-2_all.deb
 firmware-myricom_20190114-2_all.deb
 firmware-netronome_20190114-2_all.deb
 firmware-netxen_20190114-2_all.deb
 firmware-qcom-media_20190114-2_all.deb
 firmware-qlogic_20190114-2_all.deb
+firmware-ralink_20190114-2_all.deb
 firmware-realtek_20190114-2_all.deb
 firmware-samsung_20190114-2_all.deb
 firmware-siano_20190114-2_all.deb
 firmware-ti-connectivity_20190114-2_all.deb
 firmware-zd1211_1.5-6_all.deb
+grub-firmware-qemu_2.02+dfsg1-20_amd64.deb
 hdmi2usb-fx2-firmware_0.0.0~git20151225-2_all.deb
 intel-microcode_3.20191115.2~deb10u1_amd64.deb
+midisport-firmware_1.2-4_all.deb
+nxt-firmware_1.29-20120908+dfsg-7_all.deb
+sigrok-firmware-fx2lafw_0.1.6-1_all.deb
+ubertooth-firmware-source_2018.12.R1-2_all.deb
+ubertooth-firmware_2018.12.R1-2_all.deb
empty@E485 ~ %

There was a thread about this difference recently, not sure why it exists but I presume your wireless card is supported by the extra firmware that isn't included with the netinstall.

thmtrxhsu wrote:In case, your wondering that standard iso ships without a desktop, it is literally the gnome backbone that makes everything work. Naturally, if you could do a netinstall you could have a much leaner and less gnome-dependent backbone if you wanted. But as you are stuck with a netbook and wanting to use Debian, then that ISO or any of the other ISOs at that "nonfree iso-hybrid" link, may be your only choice. Anyhow it's easier to deconstruct this Debian standard (or disable memory consuming components) than to construct a Debian netinstall as you will probably need over 80% of the packages short of using a Debian Installation for the sole purpose of a terminally driven scientific calculator; might as well use tinycore then.

As long as the wireless card is supported by the netinstall ISO image then the installer includes a tasksel section which allows you to select a graphical desktop, I've used it myself *many* times to install a fully working system.

Here is a screenshot of the tasksel section in the exact netinstall ISO image to which you link:

Image
Black Lives Matter

Debian buster-backports ISO image: for new hardware support
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Re: Mini Tutorial Using Netbooks with Debian

Postby arochester » 2020-05-09 12:19

@thmtrxhsu

You do realize that you are advocating to people that they should avoid the main Debian philosophy.
The Debian Project is an association of individuals who have made common cause to create a free operating system. This operating system that we have created is called Debian.
Source - https://www.debian.org/intro/about#who

That's free as in liberty not free as in beer. The link leads to https://www.debian.org/intro/free. By that definition proprietary software is not free. Some people will buy hardware that works out-of-the box and does not need proprietary software.

You say
everything worked with Tails and Ubuntu Distros
Ubuntu does not work for everyone out-of-the-box.
Ubuntu’s commitment to only include completely free software by default means that proprietary media formats are not configured “out of the box”. See Ubuntu’s Free Software Philosophy and the Free Formats page for a more comprehensive discussion of these issues.
Source - https://help.ubuntu.com/community/RestrictedFormats ... That is perhaps why most beginners go to Linux Mint, which does readily include restricted software.

Why can't you do a netinstall on a notebook. The installation will usually tell you what wifi module is missing and putting it on a USB stick is not difficult. Or are you saying that many people don't have Ethernet ? I recently did a netinstall on an HP Stream which didn't have an Ethernet port. I bought an Ethernet to USB adapter on eBay for about $2.
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Re: Mini Tutorial Using Netbooks with Debian

Postby trinidad » 2020-05-09 14:02

I despise the formatting on the page


I personally love the classic formatting on the Debian pages. You know you're on a Debian page immediately. If I had the time and expertise I would make my desktops look like Debian web pages. There's something aesthetically reassuring about it.

TC
You can't believe your eyes if your imagination is out of focus.
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Re: Mini Tutorial Using Netbooks with Debian

Postby cuckooflew » 2020-05-09 14:14

Me to, I have never had much problem with the Debian.org pages, nor the wiki.
For any one that does, you could join the team, and help with the debian web pages, and the wiki , the wiki is very easy, ...instead of whining and crying, maybe do something to help improve them. https://www.debian.org/devel/website/
==========================
https://wiki.debian.org/how-can-i-help

==============================
Please Read What we expect you have already Done
Search Engines know a lot, and
"If God had wanted computers to work all the time, He wouldn't have invented RESET buttons"
and
Just say NO to help vampires!
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