Joel Rees on Debian-Devel wrote:Should we ask Martin whether he would be satisfied if
(1) systemd runs at some pid higher than 1?
(2) systemd is loaded, but doesn't actually run at all?
(3) systemd libraries are loaded, but systemd itself is not?
(4) Some emulation layer provides the functionality and no code from the systemd project gets to touch his disks?
(5) None of the apps he needs ask the OS to do any of the sort of things that systemd uniquely does?
I personally am not going to be satisfied unless #5 is met. That's how deep I perceive the design bugs in systemd to extend.
Randicus wrote:Option (6) - Do not infect the system with that shit. Oops. Too late.
Randicus wrote:Option (6) - Do not infect the system with that shit. Oops. Too late.
I am making this post using OpenBSD. I was a little, and pleasantly, surprised that my fairly new hardware has no difficulty running it. I hope that it can meet my needs (printing, East Asian languages and the like) and that I can figure out everything I need to know to configure the system, because its performance is amazing.keithpeter wrote:OpenBSD is, amazingly, quite laptop friendly.
Are you really naive enough to believe: 1) Debian developers are making decisions based on what the users want? They obviously are not; and 2) That those developers will read and heed a discussion involving a handful of FDN members? Look at the title of the thread - Systemd violates social contract. Hardly a discussion to find a way to overcome systemd in Debian. There are at least two threads dealing with that.buntunub wrote:Comments like this will not produce the results we would all like to see achieved - freedom of choice.
Constructive? We do not like systemd. Rant. Cry. It would be nice if ... Nothing posted in this thread will result in anything possitive. The powers that be will not tremble in fear because of this thread. Focused? Focused on what? Debian users' impotence in the face of betrayal? Systemd in Debian is a reality. Users only have one realistic choice; continue using Debian with systemd or use a different system. No amount of whining or serious discussions about theoretical options will change that.Can we keep the discussions around Systemd in Jessie+ constructive and focussed please?
Randicus wrote:We do not like systemd. Rant. Cry. It would be nice if ... Nothing posted in this thread will result in anything possitive...
bester69 wrote:There is nothing to install in linux, from time to time i go to google searching for something fresh to install in linux, but, there is nothing
n_hologram wrote:Since the idea of systemd is still relatively new to me, how would it affect Debian users running, say, XFCE (built from a netinstall)?
n_hologram wrote:If/when Debian fully adopts it, would it really affect the whole system so deeply that it would become a matter of "deal with it or get a new distro?"
dasein wrote:At the end of the day, systemd is nothing more than a bad implementation of a Really Stupid Idea.
n_hologram wrote:Since the idea of systemd is still relatively new to me, how would it affect Debian users running, say, XFCE (built from a netinstall)? I've really only heard of it in terms of Gnome3. In addition, I've run across threads from other forums (ie, Gentoo) in which a general consensus was, "if you don't like systemd, don't use it." If/when Debian fully adopts it, would it really affect the whole system so deeply that it would become a matter of "deal with it or get a new distro?"
goulo wrote:(Hmm, there is an ambiguity in these discussions whether people mean literally "systemd" itself when they talk about having systemd installed, or also libsystemd* libraries (and perhaps even dbus?) That semantic ambiguity is annoying/frustrating/confusing...)
dasein wrote:(Yes, Wheezy will still receive security updates, quite possibly for a long time if LTS comes its way; but that merely delays the problem, rather than solving it.)
dasein wrote:I found myself downloading slack just today, because I've come to accept the fact that long-term use of Debian means being stuck with systemd, and that's simply not a price I'm prepared to pay. At the end of the day, systemd is nothing more than a bad implementation of a Really Stupid Idea. "Solution in search of a problem" is the nicest thing anyone can say of it.
keithpeter wrote:@Dasein When your my age, the time horizon you tend to plan over is around RHELs support period
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