mint user wait for debian 9 or just install 8?!

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mint user wait for debian 9 or just install 8?!

Postby kdo » 2017-04-04 15:07

Hello everyone

I currently am a mint 18.1 user i used many many distros and versions over years but this is my first time that i want to install debian
My mint 18.1 has many problems and i am tired of fixing them all the time and i know that debian stretch is under full freeze for 2 month now
should i wait for 9 or just install 8 and when it released upgrade to it?
when you estimate the release date of debian 9?

Thank you for your answer
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Re: mint user wait for debian 9 or just install 8?!

Postby Ardouos » 2017-04-04 15:58

kdo wrote:should i wait for 9

If you are patient enough, yes.

kdo wrote:or just install 8 and when it released upgrade to it?

If time is of the essence to install Debian, this is probably the best option. Debian mainly supports upgrades with only "main" software though. I would recommend reading the release documentation before upgrading. I would recommend waiting though if your intention is to use Stretch to prevent any upgrade issues and having to reinstall anyway (if you may have any).

kdo wrote:when you estimate the release date of debian 9?

Not sure, maybe in a months time, maybe in 3. It will be released "when it is ready". Debian normally notify the public the date when the release nigh.
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Re: mint user wait for debian 9 or just install 8?!

Postby FreewheelinFrank » 2017-04-04 16:22

Install Debian 9 now is another option. That's what I did recently.

Stretch actually has fewer bugs that affect me than Jessie did. Your mileage may vary, as they say.
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Re: mint user wait for debian 9 or just install 8?!

Postby Bulkley » 2017-04-04 16:25

Third choice: burn a live CD (or USB) and play with it for a while. If you have virtual machine capability with your Mint, you could try installing Debian in it.
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Re: mint user wait for debian 9 or just install 8?!

Postby GarryRicketson » 2017-04-04 16:55

Really it depnds on your requirements and needs,also perhaps your hardware, none of which you give any details on.
Personally I wouldn't install either one, but my needs and requirement probably are not the same as yours. I stick with Debian 7, (wheezy).
As far as Linux mint goes, I gave up on them and stopped using it back when it was
mint 10,...
There is some documentation on the Debian websight to help people decide what
version to use:
what version of Debian shoud I use
=======================
https://www.debian.org/doc/manuals/debian-faq/ch-choosing.en.html

=============
I think, if you do some research on what they use at Linux Mint, and it is based on,
you will find that if you are having problems with the most recent versions there,
then I don't think you would want to install Debian testing (will be Debian 9 stretch when released),... However Debian 8 Jessie, also has it's "problems",...Hopefully
they may have those fixed and worked out when Debian 9 is released.
Only you can decide, what is best for you.
Using a live CD, or VM, to try out the different versions, is the best way to figure that
out.
Last edited by GarryRicketson on 2017-04-04 21:13, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: mint user wait for debian 9 or just install 8?!

Postby millpond » 2017-04-04 17:21

https://wiki.debian.org/DebianEdu/Docum ... h/Features
Agree with Garry.

Nothing there I want, and if I want it, will either backport it or compile it outside of apt.
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Re: mint user wait for debian 9 or just install 8?!

Postby kdo » 2017-04-04 17:53

GarryRicketson wrote:Really it depnds on your requirements and needs,also perhaps your hardware, none of which you give any details on.
Personally I wouldn't install either one, but my needs and requirement probably are not the same as yours. I stick with Debian 7, (wheezy).
As far as Linux mint goes, I gave up on them and stopped using it back when it was
mint 10,...
There is some documentation on the Debian websight to help people decide what
version to use:
what version of Debian shoud I use
=======================
https://www.debian.org/doc/manuals/debian-faq/ch-choosing.en.html

=============
I think, if you do some research on what they use at Linux Mint, and it is based on,
you will find that if you are having problems with the most recent versions there,
then I don't thing you would want to install Debian testing (will be Debian 9 stretch when released),... However Debian 8 Jessie, also has it's "problems",...Hopefully
they may have those fixed and worked out when Debian 9 is released.
Only you can decide, what is best for you.
Using a live CD, or VM, to try out the different versions, is the best way to figure that
out.


Thank you so much everyone really thanks a lot


Thank you i am reading them right know

I am student of mechanical engineering and mint is on my notebook
I mostly use Matlab and Corel Aftershot Right now of curse until my next project

My notebook info is:
Processor: 6700HQ
16GB of DDR4 2400 Memory
GTX 960M 4GB GPU
128GB of PCI SSD
1TB of HDD

I have so many problems with this mint(i hadnt this much before but older versions were on my PC so) like WiFi wont turn on if it was off before shutdown unless i restart system----it is absolutely slow in every were and i mean Slow---VLC crashes all the time and many others
and i tried everything like turning off WiFI power management ----- installing Nvidia Driver --- intel micro code and... that i can remember right know

The main problem is that im used to linux and i cant switch to windows until debian 9 release
I am a simple user but i dont like the look and feel of the distros like elementary os and i usually don't have problem with clean installing an os

if i install testing and then stable releases​ can i update everything to stable?is it like upgrading from 7 to 8?(i mean will my settings return to their defaults or some of my packages will be lost?)
will stable kernel which is very old have support for my hardware?
Last edited by kdo on 2017-04-04 19:05, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: mint user wait for debian 9 or just install 8?!

Postby dasein » 2017-04-04 18:30

kdo wrote:if i install testing and stable release...

You can't install both.

Immediately post-freeze is when the bug count in Testing is at its highest. But because it's frozen, it will only continue to get better with time (unless a bug fix triggers a regression).

kdo wrote:will stable kernel which is very old have support for my hardware?

If having new, shiny software is important to you, then Debian probably isn't the right distro for you. Debian values stability, not newness.

As has been suggested to you several times already, test drive Debian on a live medium and decide for yourself if it meets your needs.
Last edited by dasein on 2017-04-04 18:36, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: mint user wait for debian 9 or just install 8?!

Postby stevepusser » 2017-04-04 18:35

You have a Skylake based laptop, probably with an hybrid Optimus graphics setup, so won't get good results on Jessie unless you upgrade to kernel, drivers, and firmware packages from jessie-backports. Mint's versions of the packages might still be too old.

viewtopic.php?f=16&t=131611

Any advice to use Wheezy goes right out the door with new hardware like this--it won't work at all. Sorry, guys--it's a fact of life.
Last edited by stevepusser on 2017-04-04 21:45, edited 1 time in total.
The MX Linux repositories: Backports galore! If we don't have something, just ask and we'll try--we like challenges. New packages: AzPainter 2.0.6, Pale Moon 27.3.0, Liquorix kernel 4.11-9, mpv 0.25.0, Kodi 17.3, Ksnip 1.3.1, Mesa 13.0.6
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Re: mint user wait for debian 9 or just install 8?!

Postby kdo » 2017-04-04 18:48

dasein wrote:
kdo wrote:if i install testing and stable release...

You can't install both.

Immediately post-freeze is when the bug count in Testing is at its highest. But because it's frozen, it will only continue to get better with time (unless a bug fix triggers a regression).

kdo wrote:will stable kernel which is very old have support for my hardware?

If having new, shiny software is important to you, then Debian probably isn't the right distro for you. Debian values stability, not newness.


Thank you so testing will go out of the options

Yes i know that and so sorry it was a mistyping

No i want stability i just asked to know if that old kernel support this 'almost' new hardware?

But my question that if i install testing now ,can i update to stable when its released?(its like 7 to 8?)
Last edited by kdo on 2017-04-04 19:09, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: mint user wait for debian 9 or just install 8?!

Postby kdo » 2017-04-04 19:02

stevepusser wrote:You have a Skylake based laptop, probably with an hybrid Optimus graphics setup, so won't get good results on Jessie unless you upgrade to kernel, drivers, and firmware packages from jessie-backports. Mint's versions of the packages might still be too old.

viewtopic.php?f=16&t=131611

Any advice to use Wheezy go right out the door with new hardware like this--it won't work at all. Sorry, guys--it's a fact of life.


Thank you so much that is a really helpful topic
I wonder why I didn't found your topic after many hours of research!

Yes mint is old too and yes it has hybrid GPU (HD530)

Is there any other distro in your mind that has stability like debian stable and new kernel, firmware?or should i install Jessie and update them?
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Re: mint user wait for debian 9 or just install 8?!

Postby dasein » 2017-04-04 19:41

kdo wrote:But my question that if i install testing now ,can i update to stable when its released?

You need to visit the Wiki and read up on Debian's release model.

The freeze is the period where Testing becomes the new Stable. That is to say, Stretch is currently Testing, but when the freeze is complete, Stretch will become Stable and Jessie will become OLDSTABLE.
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Re: mint user wait for debian 9 or just install 8?!

Postby stevepusser » 2017-04-04 20:42

kdo wrote:
stevepusser wrote:You have a Skylake based laptop, probably with an hybrid Optimus graphics setup, so won't get good results on Jessie unless you upgrade to kernel, drivers, and firmware packages from jessie-backports. Mint's versions of the packages might still be too old.

viewtopic.php?f=16&t=131611

Any advice to use Wheezy go right out the door with new hardware like this--it won't work at all. Sorry, guys--it's a fact of life.


....

Is there any other distro in your mind that has stability like debian stable and new kernel, firmware?or should i install Jessie and update them?


There's the 64-bit MX 16 release, (disclaimer: I'm involved in its development) which should work with your machine right out of the box (you can test it with the Live ISO, too). It's based on Debian Jessie, but has a backported 4.7.8 kernel, firmware, drivers, etc., and works with my Skylake 520 machine right out of the box. That laptop was heavily involved in the development to make sure it worked OOTB and with the automatic Optimus Bumblebee installer, too. :mrgreen: The 32-bit MX 16 ISO still uses the older 3.16 kernel, since we decided that it should be the choice for older, less capable machines that don't need the newer kernel, and may be limited in RAM, since 32-bit uses maybe 20-30% less memory.

MX 16 currently just has the xfce4-4.12.3 desktop, but there's a 64-bit KDE 4 respin I did that has both desktops on the ISO. That leads to some menu clutter, but removing packages can clean that up after an install. You can also install other Desktops straight from the Debian repos if you wish, including good old GNOME 3 3.14.
The MX Linux repositories: Backports galore! If we don't have something, just ask and we'll try--we like challenges. New packages: AzPainter 2.0.6, Pale Moon 27.3.0, Liquorix kernel 4.11-9, mpv 0.25.0, Kodi 17.3, Ksnip 1.3.1, Mesa 13.0.6
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Re: mint user wait for debian 9 or just install 8?!

Postby Bulkley » 2017-04-04 21:08

kdo, while you are thinking and experimenting, now is a good time to backup your important stuff. Once you start messing with your system it will be easy to forget.
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Re: mint user wait for debian 9 or just install 8?!

Postby GarryRicketson » 2017-04-04 21:34

But my question that if i install testing now ,can i update to stable when its released?(its like 7 to 8?)


Yes you can, but on the programs that you may have installed, if any "packages" are
from other sources outside of the Debian repositories, it gets more complicated.

Steve is 100% correct,
Any advice to use Wheezy go right out the door with new hardware like this--it won't work at all. Sorry, guys--it's a fact of life.

with newer hardware, the older versions of Debian are not a practical choice,..plus the
amount of time they will still be supported is a lot less.
by stevepusser » There's the 64-bit MX 16 release,---snip---

I have had excellent results with the MX versions, especially on newer equipment, but also older equipment, and the support is very good.
In the Original , first post the OP did not indicate they were open to considering another distro , but if they are open to considering another distro,..the MX-16 would
be a viable, good choice, (in my opinion),...I am not involved with it in any way, just saying , based on my experiences with it.
Like wise, now don't "quote me" on this, Steve probably knows, but sometime after
Debian 9 is stable, and relesed I would expect there will be upgrades available for MX-16,...maybe even a MX-17,..?
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