Debian based Distros... Really better?

Here you can discuss every aspect of Debian. Note: not for support requests!

Debian based Distros... Really better?

Postby makh » 2017-10-31 01:36

Hi

a) Please inform that if you have found any of the debian based distro to be better and more polished then Debian, as claimed usually.

b) Please do inform the advantages you actually got.

c) Should the Debian based distros continue to develop, or they should rather be the respins?

d) Distro watch claims most users of Linux Mint, right now. Do you agree?

Thankyou
HP Probook 440 G2: Arch, Debian Stable
Server: none
Past: Debian, Centos, Ubuntu, Opensuse
GUI: Openbox, Cinnamon
Chroot: Debian, Ubuntu, Fedora
VM: Devuan

Employing the best:
Arabic
Debian
Homeopathic

For new: Try Linux Mint
User avatar
makh
 
Posts: 568
Joined: 2011-10-09 09:16

Re: Debian based Distros... Really better?

Postby RU55EL » 2017-10-31 04:14

I look at it the other way around.

After Windows 8 happened, I gave up on Windows for my personal computers. (I do have a computer with Windows on it for proprietary programs needed to support hardware that I have, such as my Logitec universal remotes.)

So, I tried Ubuntu...OK, maybe this could work. Then, several other Debian based GNU/Linux distros. But, I was never really satisfied.

Finally, I got the idea (it took me long enough) to try the OS that the others were based on.

That was when I found my absolute favorite operating system: Debian. I have tried, and upon occasion, still install some of the derivative operating systems to see how they are progressing. But, pure Debian stable is my favorite. No contrib, no non-free, just pure Debian. It has never let me down.
User avatar
RU55EL
 
Posts: 336
Joined: 2014-04-07 03:42
Location: /home/russel

Re: Debian based Distros... Really better?

Postby debiman » 2017-10-31 06:08

it looks like an objective request for opinions, but i think it's just trolling.
User avatar
debiman
 
Posts: 1633
Joined: 2013-03-12 07:18

Re: Debian based Distros... Really better?

Postby Head_on_a_Stick » 2017-10-31 06:17

makh wrote:Distro watch claims most users of Linux Mint, right now. Do you agree?

No, not at all — distrowatch.com claims that more people click on the link for Mint on their webpage than for any other distribution.

This is *not* the same thing as claiming that more people use Mint than any other distribution and distrowatch.com themselves have a disclaimer to that effect.

It is my personal opinion that the Mint developers have deployed some type of bot to keep their hit count at the top of the tree :mrgreen:

debiman wrote:i think it's just trolling

+1

However, as one of the developers of a Debian-based distribution I will offer that "better" is an entirely subjective judgement — for example, I myself prefer pure Debian over BunsenLabs but I'm sure other people feel differently.
"Sheer [program] size is often an illusion, reflecting only a need for improvement." — Kernighan and Plauger
User avatar
Head_on_a_Stick
 
Posts: 6815
Joined: 2014-06-01 17:46
Location: /dev/chair

Re: Debian based Distros... Really better?

Postby makh » 2017-10-31 09:11

debiman wrote:it looks like an objective request for opinions, but i think it's just trolling.

Sir! Due to some reasons I came from ubuntu and open suse to debian.

But now a days, basic use debian package isnt working: xbacklight. Wiki & handbook are still for ver 8. So I wanted to know opinion on the based distros. If you still want to call it a trolling ... :cry:
HP Probook 440 G2: Arch, Debian Stable
Server: none
Past: Debian, Centos, Ubuntu, Opensuse
GUI: Openbox, Cinnamon
Chroot: Debian, Ubuntu, Fedora
VM: Devuan

Employing the best:
Arabic
Debian
Homeopathic

For new: Try Linux Mint
User avatar
makh
 
Posts: 568
Joined: 2011-10-09 09:16

Re: Debian based Distros... Really better?

Postby kedaha » 2017-10-31 10:06

Debian is a meta-distribution which other distributions are derived from; as such, to adapt it to ones particular needs either as a server or, to a lesser extent, as a desktop system, can require considerable configuration. Specialised, Debian-based distributions are better for use by certain groups of users than the meta-distribution itself. Such users want to have an efficient, productive desktop environment up and running with the least hassle possible; after all, if you have other important work to do, you have to focus on it without being sidetracked into systems administration. Having said that, I would certainly not recommend any commercial linux distributions but rather Debian_Pure_Blends:
Debian Pure Blends are a solution for groups of people with specific needs. Not only do they provide handy collections (meta-packages) of specific packages, but they also ease installation and configuration for the intended purpose. They cover the interests of different groups of people, who might be children, scientists, gamers, lawyers, medical staff, visually impaired people, etc. Their common goal is to simplify installation and administration of computers for their target audience, and to connect that audience with the people writing or packaging the software they use.
Mate DE & OSSv4.
LaMp, WordPress; ispmail
Debian Stable

Words, as is well known, are the great foes of reality. Joseph Conrad.
Kedaha's Conjecture
User avatar
kedaha
 
Posts: 2801
Joined: 2008-05-24 12:26

Re: Debian based Distros... Really better?

Postby dcihon » 2017-10-31 10:21

Had to chime in.
One thing about starting off with pure Debian you can build your system the way you want with only the packages you want in it.
You can come here for support. There are some very knowledgeable and helpful people here to guide you when you have problems.
I have built my own distro starting from Debian-nonfree with MATE and compiz packages from stevepusser.
dcihon
 
Posts: 104
Joined: 2012-09-23 16:18

Re: Debian based Distros... Really better?

Postby Lysander » 2017-10-31 10:28

I'll humour you.

a) Please inform that if you have found any of the debian based distro to be better and more polished then Debian, as claimed usually.

Better at what level of experience? This is relative to the user. Mint is excellent for people who want Linux that 'just works'. Ubuntu is similarly great for beginners. They are both highly fast, stable and user-friendly. Do I find them better than Debian? No, I would say they are equally good, but for different reasons.

b) Please do inform the advantages you actually got.

Stability, user friendliness, quantity of packages [convenient for a beginner], speed, desktop environments [I used to love Unity], community support. Let's be honest, the Debian community is not that patient or tolerant of newbies, whereas the Mint and Ubuntu communities definitely are. When I was a starter, the above were all great, though over time my needs changed.

c) Should the Debian based distros continue to develop, or they should rather be the respins?

Of course they should. I don't know why this has to be asked.

d) Distro watch claims most users of Linux Mint, right now. Do you agree?

No - DW does not claim that Mint has the most users - it purely shows that the Mint page on DW has the most hits.

Regarding distro popularity - the Mint forums have over 100,000 members whereas the Ubuntu forums have over 2 million members, that should tell you something. This would mean - if we are to go on forum membership as an extremely rough indicator - that Mint has [or has had] in the region of 5% of the userbase of Ubuntu - whereas Debian has roughly 2%*. Of course not everyone who installs the OSs registers on forums [or those forums, some may register on Linux Questions or Stack Exchange], and many of those members will have moved on to other distros, but it does give an idea of the general popularity of the distros over time relative to each other.

In fact, if we are to go on forum registrations alone, which is arguably more of an accurate indicator than DW, Ubuntu would come out on top by a huge margin, followed by Fedora, then Gentoo, then Mint, then Arch, then Debian.
User avatar
Lysander
 
Posts: 364
Joined: 2017-02-23 10:07
Location: London

Re: Debian based Distros... Really better?

Postby makh » 2017-11-01 07:12

dcihon wrote:Had to chime in.
One thing about starting off with pure Debian you can build your system the way you want with only the packages you want in it.
You can come here for support. There are some very knowledgeable and helpful people here to guide you when you have problems.
I have built my own distro starting from Debian-nonfree with MATE and compiz packages from stevepusser.

Dont you fine cinnamon to be better than mate?
HP Probook 440 G2: Arch, Debian Stable
Server: none
Past: Debian, Centos, Ubuntu, Opensuse
GUI: Openbox, Cinnamon
Chroot: Debian, Ubuntu, Fedora
VM: Devuan

Employing the best:
Arabic
Debian
Homeopathic

For new: Try Linux Mint
User avatar
makh
 
Posts: 568
Joined: 2011-10-09 09:16

Re: Debian based Distros... Really better?

Postby makh » 2017-11-01 07:19

kedaha wrote:... Debian_Pure_Blends:
...

Its a good project, but general use desktop/laptop specific seems missing.
HP Probook 440 G2: Arch, Debian Stable
Server: none
Past: Debian, Centos, Ubuntu, Opensuse
GUI: Openbox, Cinnamon
Chroot: Debian, Ubuntu, Fedora
VM: Devuan

Employing the best:
Arabic
Debian
Homeopathic

For new: Try Linux Mint
User avatar
makh
 
Posts: 568
Joined: 2011-10-09 09:16

Re: Debian based Distros... Really better?

Postby Lysander » 2017-11-01 09:01

I see that you didn't respond to my last - I thought helpful - comment.

Nevertheless I will follow up with more information on why Mint is not the most popular distro.

The more I think about it this morning, the more I realise that it's very difficult to get a truly accurate feel for which distros are the most popular. I think that forum registrants are a good indicator of popularity of distro interest over time, but the failing of the theory that registrants equate to usership is that many people may register on forums but not adopt said distro. For example, when I first registered on the Debian forum it was a couple of months before I actually adopted Debian as my main OS - I nearly didn't at all had I not made the decision to put some serious work into learning it. The rest of the time before that I was using Ubuntu/Mint. I am therefore registered on the Mint forums - and still post there occasionally - but I do not use Mint anymore. So there is a difference here between a] forum registrants, b] people who no longer use the OS of the forum they are registered on and c] people who still use the OS of the forum they are registered on.

In retrospect, I find it difficult to believe that there are more Gentoo users in the world than Debian - let alone four and a half times the quantity. It doesn't seem right.

If you visit LinuxCounter, which details actual registered machines by distro, the stats are quite different. The top ten actually registered distros are:

Ubuntu
Debian
Fedora
Slackware
SUSE
Gentoo
Arch
Cent
RHEL
Kubuntu

Mint does not even feature in the top ten and is way down at number 13.

What this shows is that there is a very slow burn with distro-uptake and it takes many years for there to be any kind of long-term adoption to make a significant impact on statistics. All DW shows is that Mint has the highest amount of current interest, not the highest amount of overall downloads or installations. What we can say, with quite reliable authority, is that Ubuntu is likely the most popular distro overall, and probably by a good margin. But as to really which distros are the most popular, I think it is impossible to say with true accuracy, but Mint is not up there.
User avatar
Lysander
 
Posts: 364
Joined: 2017-02-23 10:07
Location: London

Re: Debian based Distros... Really better?

Postby pawRoot » 2017-11-01 09:36

Also many people may favour Debian on server and Mint for desktop use, most people I spoke with use Mint, it got really popular lately.
OS: Debian unstable sid
Kernel: x86_64 Linux 4.13.0-1-amd64
WM: Gnome3
CPU: Intel Core i5-4690K CPU @ 3.9GHz
MOBO: MSI Z97 Gaming 3
User avatar
pawRoot
 
Posts: 187
Joined: 2016-12-28 18:26
Location: Poland

Re: Debian based Distros... Really better?

Postby dcihon » 2017-11-01 10:16

Dont you fine cinnamon to be better than mate?


Cinnamon to me seemed not as customize-able and seemed slower to load.
I haven't tried it for a while so it may have gotten better.

At the time I chose mate I was looking for something simple solid and fast.
dcihon
 
Posts: 104
Joined: 2012-09-23 16:18

Re: Debian based Distros... Really better?

Postby makh » 2017-11-01 10:38

Lysander wrote:I'll humour you.

....

+1

You actually didnt questioned me, so thats why I didnt respond. Thankyou

Edit 1: LinuxCounter only counts the registered users/mcs.
HP Probook 440 G2: Arch, Debian Stable
Server: none
Past: Debian, Centos, Ubuntu, Opensuse
GUI: Openbox, Cinnamon
Chroot: Debian, Ubuntu, Fedora
VM: Devuan

Employing the best:
Arabic
Debian
Homeopathic

For new: Try Linux Mint
User avatar
makh
 
Posts: 568
Joined: 2011-10-09 09:16

Re: Debian based Distros... Really better?

Postby Lysander » 2017-11-01 11:17

makh wrote:
Edit 1: LinuxCounter only counts the registered users/mcs.


Indeed. Your question was "do you agree with DW that Mint is the most popular distro?". While both forum registrations and LinuxCounter are not accurate ways of determining which is the most popular distro, they do help in answering the question in showing that a] Ubuntu is very likely the most popular Linux distro overall and b] Mint is quite a way down the list.

You could ask "is Mint the most popular distro in the last year/few years?" The only answer one could provide to that is "maybe" - though I'd wager it is still behind Ubuntu.
User avatar
Lysander
 
Posts: 364
Joined: 2017-02-23 10:07
Location: London

Next

Return to General Discussion

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 2 guests

fashionable