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Cyber attack spreads worldwide

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Lysander
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Re: Cyber attack spreads worldwide

#16 Post by Lysander »

dasein wrote: And some bad news....
http://thehackernews.com/2017/05/wannac ... ttack.html
Just read about this, so somebody somewhere is developing this.
dasein wrote:Anyone who (a) isn't infected and (b) hasn't backed up in the last 24 hours, is, simply put, an idiot.
Just updated my wife's computer this afternoon [W7], hadn't been updated for months. Will get the backups going. Yes I know it's daft but so many people find updating boring, intrusive and a waste of time on Windows. I can see how so many people got done over.

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dasein
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Re: Cyber attack spreads worldwide

#17 Post by dasein »

Lysander wrote:One question, if it's old, how has it reappeared?
Every report I've read says that the specific vulnerability it exploits was reported relatively recently (March 2017). However, the underlying vulnerability itself actually resides in SMBv1, which is old, old, old. That's why XP is affected.

One of the more interesting things about this malware is that it deploys as a delivery mechanism, rather than as a specific payload. By all accounts, the actual attack vector is a "weaponized" version of a technique created by the US NSA and released to the world by ShadowBrokers. (More info here: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/EternalBlue)

That explains it was so easy for the bad guys to come up with a V 2.0 in less than a day. By implication, any arbitrary payload could be deployed.

These are not random script kiddies. Someone put some thought into this.

Hmmm... Apparently Russia is the hardest-hit nation. Maybe that's just a coincidence.

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Re: Cyber attack spreads worldwide

#18 Post by bester69 »

VentGrey wrote:Apparently Linux systems are vulnerable too, in my compulsive paranoia I disabled root acc and set all my firewalls to high, and im scanning every 2 hours, I really don't want some ransomware here :shock:

Linux has no virus, no malware, stop bullshit, there is more chance an atomic bomb explode in Paris than get infected by a linux virus. See Android Phones, Millons of users, installing thousands of Apps, and that system is unbrokeable. For sure, if you give root access then you lost it, but thats all.

By the way,for more that i try i wasnt able to root my android, they are doing really well..
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VentGrey
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Re: Cyber attack spreads worldwide

#19 Post by VentGrey »

If we look it in a good way I managed to convince 5 friends to start using Debian XD who would have thought that Ransomware helps Linux :mrgreen:
I would exchange everything I know in exchange for half of what I don't.

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alan stone
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Re: Cyber attack spreads worldwide

#20 Post by alan stone »

The NSA-created disaster explained and how to protect yourself.

All paid with U.S. tax dollars. :roll:

Meanwhile...

Microsoft has NOTHING on its home page to advise its customers. Only self-congratulatory bullshit.

Samewise for the NSA. Oh wait... there's a section "How We Protect the Nation". :lol:

But by all means, let's go to a cashless, all-digital society.
Last edited by alan stone on 2017-05-14 09:31, edited 1 time in total.

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phenest
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Re: Cyber attack spreads worldwide

#21 Post by phenest »

Lysander wrote:One question, if it's old, how has it reappeared?
I came across this exact same ransomware 4 years ago on a friends computer. I decided to research it and discovered that it was already quite old then. How old, I'm not sure exactly. I also discovered that the BitCoin account had been closed for some time back then, so you couldn't pay the ransom even if you wanted to.

My guess on how it reappeared is that someone, with an infected computer they haven't used for a while, connected it to the internet and now it's widespread again. Given how many computer are running out of date versions of Windows explains why it's so widespread. Perhaps it was me with my friends computer! :lol:
Lysander wrote:I've read that it's a bad idea to pay ransomware since there's no guarantee you'll get your data. I take it that's the case here then.
Actually, if the BitCoin account was still open, and you paid the money, you DID get the decryption tool. I read posts from people asking if they should pay, and others saying they had and now their data is back.
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alan stone
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Re: Cyber attack spreads worldwide

#22 Post by alan stone »


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Lysander
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Re: Cyber attack spreads worldwide

#23 Post by Lysander »

From the above article
Why the hell do you need "antivirus" software on a system unless it fundamentally blows big fat ones to start with?
Is this not how OSs end up getting commodified? In order to sell them, the code is closed and only has a small percentage of people working on it as opposed to open source, which creates security issues. Even though both Windows and Mac can get viruses, I don't quite understand why Windows has a whole load more. Is it because it's more exploitable, and if so, why?

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Re: Cyber attack spreads worldwide

#24 Post by acewiza »

Lysander wrote:I don't quite understand why Windows has a whole load more. Is it because it's more exploitable, and if so, why?
No. It's just because there is more of it (BIG - probably BIGGEST attack surface). And the people using it tend to be more amenable to things like clicking on malware links and subsequently paying the ransom because wait for it...

They also don't have a data backup. :roll:
Nobody would ever ask questions If everyone possessed encyclopedic knowledge of the man pages.

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phenest
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Re: Cyber attack spreads worldwide

#25 Post by phenest »

Lysander wrote:Even though both Windows and Mac can get viruses
Mac OSX is in the same boat as Linux and BSD. They don't use antivirus either.
Lysander wrote: I don't quite understand why Windows has a whole load more.
Lysander wrote: Is it because it's more exploitable, and if so, why?
To start with, all users in Windows have (by default) administrative rights. And no one bothers to change that.
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Thorny
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Re: Cyber attack spreads worldwide

#26 Post by Thorny »

Lysander wrote:... In order to sell them, the code is closed and only has a small percentage of people working on it as opposed to open source, which creates security issues. Even though both Windows and Mac can get viruses, I don't quite understand why Windows has a whole load more. Is it because it's more exploitable, and if so, why?
I see a couple of posters answered while I was composing and this states again what they have suggested.

I believe it is because Windows was not designed to be a secure, multi-user operating system from the beginning. It was designed to be easy to use, and that included easy to use by near brain dead morons who don't understand authentication nor see any need for it, because it gets in the way of them using their computer. For a long time we've seen people starting to use GNU/Linux distros after using Windows who complain about having to authenticate in order to do "things". Less of that now and modern versions of Windows do have better security but it still has more people who are basically clueless about security and don't even want to learn.

-Offer me something free and I'll click on it, send me an enticing email and I'll follow the link or open the attachment. Just tell me what keys to press. Upgrade, I don't have time to upgrade, I have to do my Facebook posts and check my twitter feeds. Why does Linux have to be so hard?-

There is a wealth of information on the Internet regarding the topic and lots of opinions. Some may even go into some of the technical reasons.

By the way, open source with more eyes on it that are not involved with the writing of the code isn't less secure, because more eyes on it generally means faults are noticed more quickly. That's my opinion.

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Re: Cyber attack spreads worldwide

#27 Post by dasein »

Lysander wrote:Even though both Windows and Mac can get viruses, I don't quite understand why Windows has a whole load more.
Bigger "bang for the buck," pure and simple.

Windows' installed user base for desktop machines is 3x the size of all other OSes combined.

There's a famous quote misattibuted to bank robber Willie Sutton. When asked why he robbed banks, Sutton supposedly replied, "Because that's where the money is."

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Re: Cyber attack spreads worldwide

#28 Post by Lysander »

Thorny wrote:
-Offer me something free and I'll click on it, send me an enticing email and I'll follow the link or open the attachment. Just tell me what keys to press. Upgrade, I don't have time to upgrade, I have to do my Facebook posts and check my twitter feeds. Why does Linux have to be so hard?-
Yes, this reminds me of a recent post over on another forum whereby a new Linux user [who shortly after decided on going back to Windows] wanted the forum to talk her through how to install her Linux system by "just pointing out the steps". She also said she ignored any pages in the install manual with "computer code" because it looked like Japanese. While I do sympathise to an extent, it does say something about the mindset of many Windows users who have become accustomed to just pressing buttons to accomplish tasks rather than taking the time to learn anything about the software or processes they are interacting with. I would imagine Windows intentionally encourages such a mindset since the more users know about their Windows computers and software, the more likely they are to realise how bad it is. How many Linuxites are disgruntled ex-Windows users?
Thorny wrote:By the way, open source with more eyes on it that are not involved with the writing of the code isn't less secure, because more eyes on it generally means faults are noticed more quickly. That's my opinion.
My sentence was worded badly, I meant to say that having closed source software creates more security issues. I am in agreement with you. I think this is something that Raymond called "given enough eyeballs, all bugs are shallow".

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phenest
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Re: Cyber attack spreads worldwide

#29 Post by phenest »

dasein wrote:Windows' installed user base for desktop machines is 3x the size of all other OSes combined.
What if it was the other way round. What if 3 quarters (or higher) of the world's userbase was using Linux and BSD, the remaining being Windows users. Linux and BSD would be a bigger target, but would these viruses/malware/ransomware succeed in the same way they have with Windows users?
I guess that's a 2 part question:
1. Would it succeed with the OS?
2. If Linux and BSD was dumbed down more to reduce the learning curve, would it succeed with the users too?
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alan stone
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Re: Cyber attack spreads worldwide

#30 Post by alan stone »

Lysander wrote:... the code is closed and only has a small percentage of people working on it... Even though both Windows and Mac can get viruses, I don't quite understand why Windows has a whole load more. Is it because it's more exploitable, and if so, why?
Not so closed as one might think and more to answer you questions.
dasein wrote:Windows' installed user base for desktop machines is 3x the size of all other OSes combined.
There's a famous quote misattibuted to bank robber Willie Sutton. When asked why he robbed banks, Sutton supposedly replied, "Because that's where the money is."
QED.

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phenest
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Re: Cyber attack spreads worldwide

#31 Post by phenest »

I was going to sign that petition. I feel sorry for people using Windows 10.
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dasein
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Re: Cyber attack spreads worldwide

#32 Post by dasein »

phenest wrote:
dasein wrote:Windows' installed user base for desktop machines is 3x the size of all other OSes combined.
What if it was the other way round...[W]ould these viruses/malware/ransomware succeed in the same way they have with Windows users?
The phrase "same way" is an invitation to imprecision and equivocation, so let's focus on the specifics you mentioned.
I guess that's a 2 part question:
1. Would it succeed with the OS?
2. If Linux and BSD was dumbed down more to reduce the learning curve, would it succeed with the users too?
Question 1 comes down to a matter of whether privilege escalation and arbitrary code execution vulnerabilities exist in Linux. They most certainly do. Many of them lie hidden for years before they were discovered. (So much for Linus' Law!) An hour at Google reviewing the history of such security issues in Linux is enough to give anyone pause.

Question 2 is a bit fuzzier. It assumes that Windows is "dumbed down" in some way that Linux is not. Is that perception affected, for instance, by the fact that Windows' default UI is a GUI? If so, then Linux is far more vulnerable, historically speaking, than Windows.

Any *nix GUI has historically required X, and X was applied retroactively and superficially atop existing core components (similar to the way Windows '95 was merely a GUI shell atop a base of largely unchanged MS-DOS). X is fundamentally insecure with a metric crap-ton of vulnerabilities all its own.

The vulnerabilities for which XP was (in)famous came down to a deeply flawed security posture; but every time a newb-ish Linux user talks about wanting to run as root 24/7, or presents "chmod 777" as a "fix" for a problem they encountered, they are actively recreating that flawed posture.

There is an additional layer of analysis available, one that focuses on design principles. But that discussion pretty much inevitably leads down a path directly towards systemd, which is a discussion I refuse to have for reasons I've articulated thoroughly elsewhere. (Some might say "thoroughly" is an understatement ;-))

P.S. You say you feel sorry for Win10 users. Ironically, they are the only Windows users unaffected by WannaCry.

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Re: Cyber attack spreads worldwide

#33 Post by phenest »

I guess it all comes down to the user again. There are those (I'm one) who would argue that Windows can be used without any antivirus or antimalware protection. I did it successfully myself for many years on Windows XP.
dasein wrote:P.S. You say you feel sorry for Win10 users. Ironically, they are the only Windows users unaffected by WannaCry.
That was not about WannaCry. The petition in the video is to do with the telemetry sent to MS which cannot be turned off in Windows 10.
dasein wrote:similar to the way Windows '95 was merely a GUI shell atop a base of largely unchanged MS-DOS
That's actually a myth. Windows '95 was not dependent on DOS except for 16bit driver compatibility only. You could not use DOS applications whilst using Windows, and vice versa. Windows '95 had its own set of libraries.
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dasein
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Re: Cyber attack spreads worldwide

#34 Post by dasein »

phenest wrote:
dasein wrote:similar to the way Windows '95 was merely a GUI shell atop a base of largely unchanged MS-DOS
That's actually a myth. Windows '95 was not dependent on DOS...
I'm not gonna debate this tangential and utterly unimportant point with you, but I'd suggest that if you're going to go around making claims such as this, you best confirm them for yourself.

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phenest
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Re: Cyber attack spreads worldwide

#35 Post by phenest »

dasein wrote:
phenest wrote:
dasein wrote:similar to the way Windows '95 was merely a GUI shell atop a base of largely unchanged MS-DOS
That's actually a myth. Windows '95 was not dependent on DOS...
I'm not gonna debate this tangential and utterly unimportant point with you, but I'd suggest that if you're going to go around making claims such as this, you best confirm them for yourself.
It's not a claim. If you booted into Windows '95, DOS was demoted to a compatibility layer for 16bit drivers. That's a fact. Perhaps you can show me proof of YOUR claim that it was merely a GUI shell.
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