Re: Wow. Really?
Posted: 2017-05-30 14:28
Translation from http://forum.debianizzati.org/viewtopic ... 04#p188107 dated 11/30/2014I want to emphasize that Devuan is NOT Debian without - or worse, "against" - systemd. Systemd will be supported in Devuan. Devuan is a fork in favor of freedom of choice. Sysvinit will remain the default init system, but all init systems will be supported - at least, all those that are packaged in Debian at the moment.
At last, someone who knows how to answer a question.golinux wrote:Not without unpinning and reassembling packages that have been santized of frivolous 'entanglements'. I would predict dependency hell and unlikely things would work very well.phenest wrote:But is it possible to install systemd in Devuan?
That was well over two years ago. The landscape has changed a LOT since then. Most importantly, systemd has become much more than init. Its system wide entanglements have made co-existence within a single installation an impossibility. Think what a glacier does slowly to everything in its path. Eventually there is only the glacier . . .arochester wrote:Translation from http://forum.debianizzati.org/viewtopic ... 04#p188107 dated 11/30/2014I want to emphasize that Devuan is NOT Debian without - or worse, "against" - systemd. Systemd will be supported in Devuan. Devuan is a fork in favor of freedom of choice. Sysvinit will remain the default init system, but all init systems will be supported - at least, all those that are packaged in Debian at the moment.
Yes, you are right. I really miss it, full of happiness popular and exciting systemd. I loved when my system hangs while shutting down, love message, like: "A stop job is running for..." https://postimg.org/image/ar7e3ashz, And he's a good companion, and can easily solve the problem when nothing else to do. With systemd there is always something to do! After all, systemd to take care of my health when I want to restart the computer which is far away from me, he will hang him and I will definitely have to raise my ass and go to my computer, because the walk is very good for your health.No idea how I will live and miss the beloved systemd!phenest wrote:Devuan forums fill up with posts about how better Devuan is than Debian but they need systemd for some reason. I can't think of a reason but someone will..
Like, Debian Jessie released April 26th, 2015 - WITH SYSTEMDThat was well over two years ago. The landscape has changed a LOT since then. Most importantly, systemd has become much more than init.
Not here.With systemd there is always something to do!
Currently only a very small number of packages require attention. But we are aware that at some point Devuan may have to become an 'independent' distribution. Our exodus plan was intended to allow current Debian users a smooth upgrade path from Debian (Wheezy or Jessie) to Devuan Jessie. After Jessie that conversion will no longer be possible ie Stretch to ASCII. It will require a reinstall.arochester wrote:(Theoretically) If Debian disappeared overnight, would Devuan be able to take its place? Yes or No?
A one-trick pony?Currently only a very small number of packages require attention
- https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/one-trick_ponyA person or group noteworthy for only a single achievement, skill, or characteristic.
Not really getting that except it sounds demeaning and unknowledgeable about how Devuan is built/set up.arochester wrote:A one-trick pony?Currently only a very small number of packages require attention- https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/one-trick_ponyA person or group noteworthy for only a single achievement, skill, or characteristic.
Yes. Quite possibly no longer directly dependent on the Debian repos. We could work from a cached repository of Debian pkgs and use that as our base for Devuan pkgs moving forward and/or work directly from upstream source. ASCII should be OK with our cuirrent setup. Beowulf? I don't have a crystal ball . . .arochester wrote:What is an "independent" distribution. Not a fork? Not a derivative? But independent???
If Devuan can do more than one thing that Debian doesn't do, do you want to tell us about that?Not really getting that
LOL! I keep visualizing lemmings going over a cliff . . . Assuming that numbers somehow equate to 'right' is an illogical and unjustifiable conclusion. A majority is just that and has nothing to do with a judgment of 'right' or 'wrong'. The issue is choice. Your 'right' might be my 'wrong' and vice versa.arochester wrote:1) So... (amongst others)...
Arch Linux is wrong.
CentOS is wrong.
CoreOS is wrong.
Debian is wrong.
Fedora is wrong.
Mageia is wrong.
OpenSUSE is wrong.
Redhat Enterprise Linux is wrong.
Suse Linux Enterprise Server is wrong.
Ubuntu is wrong.
Devuan is right.
We have fixed several bugs and sent patches back to Debian. Plus we have developed unique package management and image building workflows,arochester wrote:2)If Devuan can do more than one thing that Debian doesn't do, do you want to tell us about that?Not really getting that
Wait... I can fix that for you...If Devuan can do more than one thing that Debian doesn't do, do you want to tell us about that?
No, actually not me, a mod or admin decided to pin it,...by fsmithred »But you fixed it double. You pinned the original, and this one is still here.
Please explain this "hook" you speak of. I am unaware of any liability the Debian community may or may not have towards Devuan or their users. But then again, the list of things I am unaware of is certainly much longer than the list of things I am aware of.Bulkley wrote:The Devuan fork lets Debian developers off the hook for users who need the option.
Really? I've seen none of that. You can call me lucky, but none of my 3 computers have shown any evidence that systemd requires maintenance, or that it's buggy.None1975 wrote:Yes, you are right. I really miss it, full of happiness popular and exciting systemd. I loved when my system hangs while shutting down, love message, like: "A stop job is running for..." https://postimg.org/image/ar7e3ashz, And he's a good companion, and can easily solve the problem when nothing else to do. With systemd there is always something to do!phenest wrote:Devuan forums fill up with posts about how better Devuan is than Debian but they need systemd for some reason. I can't think of a reason but someone will..
There's no liability, just guilt. It's sort of like food banks let politicians avoid responsibility for hungry children. Devuan helps to take the pressure off Debian developers to provide init choices. If Debian developers had done their job properly a bunch of disgruntled users would not have felt it necessary to break away and create a fork distro. Just sayin'.acewiza wrote:Please explain this "hook" you speak of. I am unaware of any liability the Debian community may or may not have towards Devuan or their users.Bulkley wrote:The Devuan fork lets Debian developers off the hook for users who need the option.