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Test

PostPosted: 2007-04-11 16:12
by ghostdawg
This is just a test to see why my posts time stamps are off by one hour...

Only a test!

Test 2

PostPosted: 2007-04-11 16:13
by ghostdawg
Testing...I guess when stupid Bush had DST start early this year, it threw my time zone off here....

Fixed now.

PostPosted: 2007-04-12 05:24
by dmn_clown
It's a good idea, it keeps the lights off longer which will save electricity and hopefully reduce green house gases released from all of those lovely "clean coal" power plants being built (and the existing ones).

Unless of course you live in Indiana where several politicians were elected solely because they promised to repeal DST, then it is the end of world...

PostPosted: 2007-04-12 06:09
by Lavene
DST is just silly when you live here up north. During summer the sun hardly sets here where I live, a bit further north it does not set at all (the land of the midnight sun and all that).

Of course, it would be even sillier if we did not follow the rest of Europe ;)

PostPosted: 2007-04-12 10:33
by hkoster1
Lavene wrote:Of course, it would be even sillier if we did not follow the rest of Europe ;)
...except for the EU. :roll:

PostPosted: 2007-04-12 11:00
by Lavene
hkoster1 wrote:
Lavene wrote:Of course, it would be even sillier if we did not follow the rest of Europe ;)
...except for the EU. :roll:


Yeah. That's what happen in a glorious democracy where everyone is allowed to vote, and most of the people walk through life with blinders, looking down at their shoe tip while thy chant "it's mine it's mine". "Don't take my fish. Don't take my oil. Don't take our jobs."
That's fine really if they made some informed decision.

The problem is however a small thing called the EEC which the sheep mention above seem oblivious to. So in th end every whim from EU gets forced upon us because of EEC and we have nothing to say.

But since the majority of the Norwegian people still believe that actually being part of EU would mean that a huge monster comes swallowing up every resource we have, well, we are stuck with whatever EU decide without even getting as much as a vote.

AARGH! I just violated the 'non-politics' policy of the board with this rant... I have to give my self a warning!

Tina

PostPosted: 2007-04-13 01:38
by ghostdawg
dmn_clown wrote:It's a good idea, it keeps the lights off longer which will save electricity and hopefully reduce green house gases released from all of those lovely "clean coal" power plants being built (and the existing ones)

It would also be a good idea if we dumped coal & oil for some other alternative fuel.

I don't know how many here remember we went through a oil crises back in the 1970s under another stupid president called Nixon. You would think by now alternative fuel would be working great by now.

Dohhh, but then the Bushes wouldn't be able to keep getting rich from oil...O well!

PostPosted: 2007-04-13 06:00
by dmn_clown
ghostdawg wrote:It would also be a good idea if we dumped coal & oil for some other alternative fuel.

I don't know how many here remember we went through a oil crises back in the 1970s under another stupid president called Nixon. You would think by now alternative fuel would be working great by now.

Dohhh, but then the Bushes wouldn't be able to keep getting rich from oil...O well!


When the oil companies can find a way to market an alternative fuel and still keep their monopoly (read our $$ coming in) then we'll have it. Why do you think they are pushing E85 when it isn't a viable replacement?

Oh well, indeed.

PostPosted: 2007-04-13 06:59
by e1even1
ghostdawg wrote:It would also be a good idea if we dumped coal & oil for some other alternative fuel.


unfortunately, coal is so abundant that it reduces any incentives we have to find alternatives.

Worldwide, coal is the most abundant of the fossil fuels, and its reserves are also the most widely distributed. Estimates of the world's total recoverable reserves of coal in 2002 were about 1,081 billion sort tons. The resulting ratio of coal reserves to production exceeds 200 years,


and wind mills have our environmentalists tripping about birds. i think that the real answer is nuclear. but we have to start shooting the waste off into the sun, instead of keeping it here.

we have plenty of problems to solve.

PostPosted: 2007-04-13 14:30
by Lavene
There is one thing that would really help, does not require new technology, does not harm birds, fish or any other animal: Stop consuming all that energy!!

There are no such thing as a free lunch. In Norway windmills was/ is a big hit. Unfortunately one of the windmill parks killed off half the population of some eagles that's already rare to the point of extinction.

And they are building a new environmentally friendly gas power plant. That is, it will be environmentally friendly in 2012, IF they have the technology needed ready at that time.

Creating energy takes it's toll no matter how you do it.

PostPosted: 2007-04-13 14:48
by DeanLinkous
now lavene that would require some effort
it would require people not doing the same things

we want the cake and the icing - keep doing everything that we currently do, the way we do it now and some miracle that makes the problems go away

PostPosted: 2007-04-13 15:57
by garrincha
A little off Debian topic that hopefully we will not get chealered. :)

I actually thought the the half century dependence on oil stifled technology innovation and progress in alternative fuel technology. There were very little researches on alternative energy technology, potentially clean energy including water (Earth is more than 70% covered with water), solar and nuclear fission. Of course it doesn't help that the oil consortium was and is still very powerful. Have a look at the practice of Standard Oil (Esso) or what popularly became known today as "Robber Baron".

Remember also, that oil or more correctly petroleum also fuelled a of technological revolutions post-WWII, things like solvents, fertilizers, pesticides, and plastics, thus giving birth to the "plastic lifestyle" we all led. Hey are you using a plastic laptop? Can you dispose of it? :)

Now, we (at least in the West) are really in trouble if the Mid East start to burn brightly and Iran started to flex her powerful muscle by exporting their even larger reserve of oil favourably to countries like India and China, mainly because more than 60% of reserve came from this region. And you wondered why in the past they wanted to prop up the autocratic Shah after the overthrow of democratically elected president Dr. Mohammad Mossadegh by a CIA backed group? It's no wonder that thing have not changed as the USA is lining up and taking aim at Hugo Chavez and Venezuela. Why? Because Venezuela and the Guianas highland in the South America Atlantic coast have the largest reserve of oil due to crude oil from bitumen.

PostPosted: 2007-04-13 17:07
by Lavene
garrincha wrote:Remember also, that oil or more correctly petroleum also fuelled a of technological revolutions post-WWII, things like solvents, fertilizers, pesticides, and plastics, thus giving birth to the "plastic lifestyle" we all led. Hey are you using a plastic laptop? Can you dispose of it? :)


We don't have to move back to the stone age to make a huge difference. I do however try to du my share: We have only one TV set and it's only on when we are actually watching something. We turn off the lights in the rooms we are not in (and of course during daytime). I recycle everything that can be recycled. I don't own a car because I live in a place where bus and train is a viable alternative. If possible I sacrifice a few hours and use the train instead of airplanes if possible when traveling.

There are a million minor changes one can make to the lifestyle that will have a huge impact on the environment. But of course... people don't want to do that. They want to cry out to everyone else demanding change.

Tina

PostPosted: 2007-04-13 17:10
by <(DmC)>
Lavene wrote:There is one thing that would really help, does not require new technology, does not harm birds, fish or any other animal: Stop consuming all that energy!! (...)
Creating energy takes it's toll no matter how you do it.

i agree with you completely! it is particularly interesting that most of the energy is being consumed by a very small percentage of the earths human population...

DeanLinkous wrote:we want the cake and the icing - keep doing everything that we currently do, the way we do it now and some miracle that makes the problems go away


obviously, your "we" doesn't refer to mankind in general, eh? i am just curious who you mean by "we"... pluralis majestatis maybe? :P




dmn_clown wrote:When the oil companies can find a way to market an alternative fuel and still keep their monopoly (read our $$ coming in) then we'll have it. Why do you think they are pushing E85 when it isn't a viable replacement?


imho it is indeed important to recognize that "alternative fuel" is not that much of an alternative because it still needs to be produced somehow, which usually is very energy-consuming in the first place.
if anyone is interested in the end of the oil-age and the scientific future that is linked to it, i recommend the movie "the end of suburbia", which only focusses on the effects of the US, though...

anyway, have a good day everyone.


EDIT:
Lavene wrote:There are a million minor changes one can make to the lifestyle that will have a huge impact on the environment. But of course... people don't want to do that. They want to cry out to everyone else demanding change.

Tina


once again, i generally agree with you... however, there is a reason that often depresses me when i consider my impact. in terms of pollution for example, but also in terms of energy consumption, it is demoralizing to me to think how little the individuals contribute when compared to the effects induced by large companies. freight ships dump tons of waste into the oceans. all sorts of plants and factories distribute smoke in the atmosphere and toxic liquids in the rivers. even the honorable task of recycling is often very energy-demanding... nonetheless, it is irreplacable for every individual to reduce their own "footprint". it just depresses me to think about the big picture sometimes... :cry:

so depressed greetings,

PostPosted: 2007-04-13 17:41
by llivv
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