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eBook Reader or Tablet

Off-Topic discussions about science, technology, and non Debian specific topics.
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pendrachken
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Re: eBook Reader or Tablet

#16 Post by pendrachken »

pylkko wrote:Tablet's and other computers generally have some kind of backlighterd display. Perhaps and LCD or AMOLED, which means that there is a large lamp shining light, and on top of that is a layer of pixels that can change the light in different wys to form an image. E-book readers tend to have E-ink displays, which do not have a lamp, but the image is created by dark or coloured specks that can be turned on or of with electric current and which reflect light. (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electronic_paper). This is the reason that they cause less eye fatigue and are so aesthetically pleasing. You can buy linux controllable E-ink displays. People often control these with Raspberry pi's and simiar to make low power displays of information (news, calendar, weather that kind of stuff)

However, I believe that all commercial (not DIY) E-book readers -- or at least do not know of one that is not -- organized so that the content that you buy is "not yours". That is, there is a server somewhere, and when you pay for a book, you unlock access to it on that server for youtself. This means you cannot read your own made documents, pirated stuff, and need to have a mobile connection. You also cannot just give the book to a friend, for example. According to Wikipedia, Amazon Kindle has a service where you can email stuff to Amazon and they will put ot into your account (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Amazon_Kindle). This is the reason that I do not have one of these readers although I like the displays.

If you googled that far you might just have found a little something called "calibre". You know the little program for Win/Linux/Mac that talks to pretty much all of the ebook readers out there ( and even tablets with ereader software ) and lets you put your own books on the reader. It even helpfully converts pretty much any format out there to any other format so you can guarantee that your reader can read the book.


I only occasionally turn the wifi on my kindle paperwhite on, and that is only if I have books lined up in kindle unlimited to download. ~600 books on it right now, 10 from kindle unlimited, 0 from being bought on amazon, and ~590 bought / pirated from other places and DRM free. So no, you don't ever HAVE to turn on the wifi.

As for the rest of the discussion about backlights - the kindle paperwhite / nook glow ( if they still make it? ) are e-ink displays with lighting. You can read in the dark just as well as you can in direct sunlight. I actually find the default ~50% brightness on mine WAY too bright. 10% is plenty to read with in dark areas, and saves the battery quite a bit. At 10% backlight I can go 3-5 weeks with wifi off and reading 3-5 hours a day between charges.
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pylkko
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Re: eBook Reader or Tablet

#17 Post by pylkko »

pendrachken wrote: If you googled that far you might just have found a little something called "calibre". You know the little program for Win/Linux/Mac that talks to pretty much all of the ebook readers out there ( and even tablets with ereader software ) and lets you put your own books on the reader. It even helpfully converts pretty much any format out there to any other format so you can guarantee that your reader can read the book.

I only occasionally turn the wifi on my kindle paperwhite on, and that is only if I have books lined up in kindle unlimited to download. ~600 books on it right now, 10 from kindle unlimited, 0 from being bought on amazon, and ~590 bought / pirated from other places and DRM free. So no, you don't ever HAVE to turn on the wifi.
I have never had one of these devices, and have always heard about how the content is not transferable and even that you do not from the perspective of legislation have the right to copy the content even for your self. I have tried to read ebooks from libraries on calibre, but it cannot open them a they have some form of DRM.
As for the rest of the discussion about backlights - the kindle paperwhite / nook glow ( if they still make it? ) are e-ink displays with lighting. You can read in the dark just as well as you can in direct sunlight. I actually find the default ~50% brightness on mine WAY too bright. 10% is plenty to read with in dark areas, and saves the battery quite a bit. At 10% backlight I can go 3-5 weeks with wifi off and reading 3-5 hours a day between charges.
Do they really have back lights? I thought they have edge lights. For me, having a back light kind of defeats the purpose. Although you cannot read in the dark just as you cannot read a book in the dark, if there is no light. I have never had an e-book reader, but some e-ink displays that I have used have the capacity to hold the image even when they are unplugged, a fact that makes them extremely energy efficient for displaying certain kind of information (that doesn't need to be updated often). But with a backlight its just mildly better than a tablet, which can probably do many more things.

Last year I read about a few new technologies that were claimed to be future e-ink killers, in the sense that they would be so much better that all manufacturers would switch to them. One of them was called "ClearInk" and other I forgot what it is called. But it does not seem to be that they have taken off or become popular.

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qyron
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Re: eBook Reader or Tablet

#18 Post by qyron »

Technical discussions aside, for the moment, I'm still fighting to grasp why the eReader is so much more costly when compared with the run of the mill tablet computer.

THE big retailer here (FNAC) sells Kobo eReaders (it's the official eReader for the chain, although other brands are available through their "marketplace", by independent merchants) and these little underpowered - and under-featured - machines are easily twice the price of a generic brand 10 inch tablet, with entry prices opening at €119,99 and the most expensive model going for €279,99. That is a big chunk of money when compared with the average €69,90 price tag on the competition.

Besides having a lot less memory available for storage (between 4GB and 8GB), I haven't seen any mention to expansion slots although there are some competitor models that have it (a model that goes for nearly €600 can expand up to 32GB via SD card), some of these machines boast having full internet navigation capabilities (on a fully B&W screen?). The average eReader also has a screen quite small (going from 6 inches to 7.8 inches - this last one being a bit odd in dimensions).

I approached the eReaders as more comfortable option to expand my opportunities to read but as I go along, either by doing more and more research and following this thread, it seems the technology is being charged at a premium with no real added value when compared to a tablet, except for the extra long battery life.
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pylkko
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Re: eBook Reader or Tablet

#19 Post by pylkko »

One thing is that the electrophoresis based display tech is more costlier. When you compare any kind of LCD, OLED of the same size to even the most primitive E-ink display module, the price is double or triple. This probably has also to do with the fact that there are not so many manufacturers and the techs are heavily patented.

Another thing probably is the shear volume that tablets are sold in.

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qyron
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Re: eBook Reader or Tablet

#20 Post by qyron »

pylkko wrote:[...} and the techs are heavily patented.
This was something I wanted to mention and I completely overlooked as I wrote my previous reply.

Although most - if not all - eReaders have a very wide file format reading capability (with the EPUB standard being for all practical reasons universal) I was stunned to hear sales people trying to push the notion that although this and other formats were indeed readable, it should be expected from the users poor(er) performance when compared with the proprietary format of the reader parent company.

Taking into consideration that the EPUB format is the technical standard from which proprietary formats are usually converted this is a very dirty tactic to grab users/customers.

More and more, the scenario of using a tablet with an ebook reading app is looking more and more appealing.
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kevinthefixer
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Re: eBook Reader or Tablet

#21 Post by kevinthefixer »

Couple of observations or cautions: first, bear in mind that not all tablets are created equal. Sure, there are budget tablets out there, but if you buy a cheap tablet, you are likely to get a cheap tablet--that is, one that requires an expert workover to make it useable even as an e-reader. Should you get a tablet, do your eyes a favor and make very sure it has an IPS display (in-plane switching). Very few tablets have a screen that is visible in sunlight; if that is a concern, you need an e-ink display for that. I have used Calibre to convert Kindle books that I have bought to DRM-free .epub format so that I can read them on my Android tablet with my preferred reader (Cool Reader) rather than Amazon's bloated and buggy Kindle app. Legal or not, I don't sell such converted files so I doubt anyone much cares if they're "pirated"--they got paid! A modern Android tablet is actually quite a tech marvel, it can be used pretty much as a laptop computer. By "modern" I mean anything with Lollipop or newer OS; KitKat was a disaster and anything older will be very slow. But a 10" tab with a BT keyboard and mouse, and appropriate software, rivals a PC of, say, 10 years ago in performance. I can't speak to Windows tablets but Android has certainly matured to that level and maybe beyond, all mine are >5 years old (most have custom ROMs, what we'd call an OS on a PC). So buying a tablet and accessories might make more sense than buying a laptop and an e-reader financially. Whatever you do buy, I recommend Project Gutenberg to your attention; they have a huge repository of public-domain books available for free download in many formats. https://www.gutenberg.org/

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qyron
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Re: eBook Reader or Tablet

#22 Post by qyron »

@Kevinthefixer

I'm an huge fan and user of Project Gutenberg. I've found there books, in my own native language, that are basically impossible to access or find, unless you are willing to invest a lot of your time searching in old used book stores or you are a scholastic researcher with access to our national library archives.

Regarding the tablets: I've never gave much attention to tablets and only have used one a couple of times but not with a very focused mind to the task at hand, to get a proper grasp of the machine I was making use of. What I make of reading on a screen is through my phone, which is an Android device, and going through several different apps to find that one that satisfies my needs (I mostly use F-Droid to source my apps). I currently use a very "barebones" app, simply called Book Reader.

Actually purchasing a tablet is going to prove somewhat of a challenge because of this. I don't really know what to really look for in a tablet. Most budget/entry level 7 inch tablets seem more than adequate for reading. I don't intend to read under direct sun light but even if forced to, the app I currently use on my phone has a dark/light theming preset, that aids a lot in adjusting to different reading conditions. Although a 10 inch equipment could prove more flexible in therms of other usages, all models I've seen look a bit... bulky. At least when compared to a book. I think I'd feel as if holding up a small TV to my face.

One thing I'm not ashamed to admit is that I like to keep waters parted and computers have their place and tablets have their. I arrived late to computers and my first experience was with a desktop and that was what captivated me. I later also had a laptop, and was very pleased with it, but somehow laptops fail to grab me fully; tablet's fail even further. The thought of having to buy a laptop for work reasons in a very short time frame is not pleasing and the first thing I considered was the very basic entry line netbooks, that will more than suffice for my needs after I get my hands on it and get a proper SO in it (Linux). My main machine is a standard desktop and even it can be considered a very modest one, even when it was brand new.

I'll keep your words in mind and take your advices into consideration when spending my money is in order.

Thank you.
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trinidad
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Re: eBook Reader or Tablet

#23 Post by trinidad »

E-pub extensions are available for LibreOffice Writer and once you have completed a work you can finish publishing it with Callibre, and any reader will be able to read it. HTML is an even easier option for a classroom scenario.

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millpond
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Re: eBook Reader or Tablet

#24 Post by millpond »

I would also suggest calibre as an ebook tool. It has dozens of plugins to customize your own elibrary.

RCA makes a tablet/laptop (it has a detachable keyboard), and is installed with Win10, so can load real appllications, and not the android toy apps. However, not good in sunlight.

KBD47
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Re: eBook Reader or Tablet

#25 Post by KBD47 »

I've had several of both, and while the e-ink devices are nice, I finally just stuck with a tablet. Right now I had the Fire 8HD Amazon tablet. Nice size for reading and if your eyes get tired you can just have Alexa read the book for you :)

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Demor
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Re: eBook Reader or Tablet

#26 Post by Demor »

The tablet can do much more, but it quickly discharges the battery.

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qyron
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Re: eBook Reader or Tablet

#27 Post by qyron »

I forgot to update on this...

Because I recently had a mishap with my cellphone (dropped it in the toilet...)

[Seriously, just how clumsy and lazy does it take to drop a phone in the toilet? Really? I had the damn thing in my pocket. Then suddenly it seemed to gain a mind of its own and jumped out of my pocket as if leaping from a diving board and took a straight plunge into the yellow lagoon... I actually liked that phone.]

Instead of buying a new smartphone ( and because it was actually cheaper) I got myself a phablet or whatever the thing is called. It has a 10 inch screen so I can pretty much use as any other conventional tablet, with the added bonus of making an idiot out of myself when answering a call on the thing. I'll be the life of party.
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qyron
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Re: eBook Reader or Tablet

#28 Post by qyron »

The phablet thing ended up revealing itself as a quite good ereader.

It's a generic tablet. The boot screen just says it's a Mediatek and that is it; I can't pinpoint a specific model.

I get more tired to keep the thing up (it becomes heavy after some time) than to actually read from it.
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