Why do people give up , instead of provideing details

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Re: Why do people give up , instead of provideing details

Postby sickpig » 2019-05-16 23:50

Relax friend, English is not my first language either, but i dont believe that makes me entitled to special treatment or concession of any kind. I also dont blame or want any group to instil cultural values in me either. But if you feel that way then I respect your right to your beliefs. I may not agree with your view but I agree that you have the right to believe whatever you want.
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Re: Why do people give up , instead of provideing details

Postby Deb-fan » 2019-08-31 04:10

Know this thread is old. Actually agree with some of sickpigs statements. On the topic, think people give up w/o etc, cause they're lazy and/or stoopid + possibly also of low character too = feel entitled, everything should be theirs, made easy for them. If this is so of those people, think good riddens. As I've got no interest in trying to assist that kind anyway. Yeah this post is negative and harsh but it's how I feel.
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Why do people give up , instead of provideing details

Postby PsySc0rpi0n » 2019-08-31 04:54

I didn't read all trplies in this thread but I would like to leave my bit.
As someone that asks for help, many many times in several places such has forums and IRC (yes, old IRC), I can say good and bad things about both sides. This is just my opinion.
I've been using IRC for probably the past 20 years, and forums too.
And what I can say is that, yes, there is very lazy people and stupid people in both sides. The side of who asks and the side of who is helping. And this has been becoming more and more evident as time passes. I don't remember to see this behaviour when I started using the Internet for searching info.
Anyway, I've probably had more situations as a guy who's seeking help than as a guy providing help. In IRC, mostly what I get is an already made up word "RTFM". Or the "Don't ask to aks. Just ask." Well, specially in IRC I don't agree with this for a single reason. Although there are many nicks in a channel, most of them are idling so there's no point if asking a question if no one is there to reply. Because if you ask and nobody is there for a few hours, when you get back there to check if there was any reply, even your question is already gone due to parts, joins, info's, etc, etc and also other people talking. Another reason is if a channel is too active with people talking at the same time, your question will also scroll up and get lost in a blink of an eye.
And people helping is getting a lot more "flammable". They get flamed for almost anything and will insult you out of almost nothing. I've witnessed myself many flames, mostly in IRC, which is a shame.
But I also came across a few situations where the person seeking help is stupid enough to not accept the fact that who's helping my also have limited knowledge on the subject or simply is out of time to help in that moment or some other reasons.

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Re: Why do people give up , instead of provideing details

Postby Deb-fan » 2019-08-31 05:46

Really of course not saying everyone asking for help support falls into a bad niche. If someone tries and can't figure something out, don't see the harm in asking. Though people who do their own research many times will/should post more thoughtful help requests. Rather than what Garry was talking about. Been forever since I've participated with things like Irc. Not surprising if many trolls, b-holes, nor people who aren't really competent themselves flock there to share their expertise. Though think it's the price of instant gratification too. Ie: I've got xyz problem, someone help me solve it right now, I don't want to wait.

Really think things like this forum make more sense for folks wanting help/support. Someone who wants/needs real time support is probably better off calling the geek squad or people who make their living doing tech support. Gonna shut it, not like anything typed here is going to make much difference. Blah blah. :)
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Re: Why do people give up , instead of provideing details

Postby sunrat » 2019-08-31 05:52

Deb-fan wrote:Know this thread is old. Actually agree with some of sickpigs statements. On the topic, think people give up w/o etc, cause they're lazy and/or stoopid + possibly also of low character too = feel entitled, everything should be theirs, made easy for them. If this is so of those people, think good riddens. As I've got no interest in trying to assist that kind anyway. Yeah this post is negative and harsh but it's how I feel.


You spelled "riddance" wrong. :mrgreen:
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Re: Why do people give up , instead of provideing details

Postby Deb-fan » 2019-08-31 05:56

^ :D I've had too much coffee, time for bed anyway.
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Re: Why do people give up , instead of provideing details

Postby pendrachken » 2019-08-31 14:38

pinot wrote:a newbies take:( then i guess i will leave too).


3. hubris by these people that know debian. the RTFM thing still exists. why read the whole manual when the answer(s) might be from pp.241,363,and 466. they are looking for the cogent answer. or the search the internet thing. what are you lazy? well i hve found answers or parts of answers but the instructions and commands and processes assume you are at a decently beginning advanced level and not a numb nuts like me. and then if you can't search then linuc or debian is not for you.



It still exists because people don't DO IT.


Told a person to RTFM a week or so ago. A person who "read the whole thing" and did "extensive googling and research" into the problem. The manual page "was no help at all, even after reading the whole thing".

They were asking how to do some configuration that was described and had an example of exactly what they wanted to do in the man page. Yep, no help at all in the man page, I mean literal cut / paste and changing a number or two is sooooo hard. And the man page quite literally has the section heading that is the "this is how to do the thing you wanted to do with the question you asked".
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Re: Why do people give up , instead of provideing details

Postby phenest » 2019-08-31 15:13

sunrat wrote:You spelled "riddance" wrong. :mrgreen:

That should be "spelt" not "spelled". :roll:
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Re: Why do people give up , instead of provideing details

Postby NFT5 » 2019-08-31 15:59

phenest wrote:
sunrat wrote:You spelled "riddance" wrong. :mrgreen:

That should be "spelt" not "spelled". :roll:


Arguable. Unfortunately the insidious bastardisation of English by American TV combined with a lack of resistance resultant from inherent laziness and the liberalisation of those in our education system means that either is now acceptable. :(

Just look at the title of this thread. :roll:

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Re: Why do people give up , instead of provideing details

Postby Segfault » 2019-08-31 16:36

It takes two to tango.
Those who ask for help should know, there is a human being in the other end. Make it easy and pleasant to answer your question and you will be surprised how many will respond, in a good way.
OTOH, if you ignore replies then the person in the other end will feel insulted. "I tried, I was thinking for him, spent my time, and did he even read it?" Not a way to make friends, is it?
I've noticed people often ignore what they don't understand. Example case below:
Q: Help, my <piece of hardware> is not working!
A: OK, what's the PCI ID of this piece? (You want to search net using this ID, see if other Linux users have had same issue, how it was solved.)
But there is no response, see, OP does not know what PCI ID is and thus decided the best way to deal with it is to ignore it. An intelligent person would have used net to search for PCI ID definition, how to determine it in Linux. Or at least reacted with a new question: what is it, how can I find it? But they do the worst - they just skip it.
Now, did I say there is a human answering these questions? This human has every right to be pissed off now and either blacklist this poster or say something sarcastic.
Those who answer questions develop a sixth sense, it can often be seen already from the initial post whether it will be rewarding or not to "take the case". And here you have a good reason why some posts stay unanswered for a long time, or until some enthusiast (usually knowledgeable newcomer) decides to try his/her luck. Often burns his/her fingers ... but experience is something you get just after you needed it, even if it is merely experience to decide whether to get involved or not.
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Re: Why do people give up , instead of provideing details

Postby Deb-fan » 2019-08-31 18:43

phenest wrote:
sunrat wrote:You spelled "riddance" wrong. :mrgreen:

That should be "spelt" not "spelled". :roll:


Nice. :) lmao, Sunrat was right too. Even Googled to confirm. :)
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Re: Why do people give up , instead of provideing details

Postby arochester » 2019-08-31 18:54

That should be "spelt" not "spelled". :roll:


Depends where you live! UK English or US English. https://www.grammarly.com/blog/spelled-spelt/
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Re: Why do people give up , instead of provideing details

Postby phenest » 2019-08-31 20:18

arochester wrote:
That should be "spelt" not "spelled". :roll:


Depends where you live! UK English or US English. https://www.grammarly.com/blog/spelled-spelt/

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Re: Why do people give up , instead of provideing details

Postby golinux » 2019-08-31 20:30

phenest wrote:That should be "spelt" not "spelled". :roll:
From Wikipedia says:
Spelt (Triticum spelta; Triticum dicoccum), also known as dinkel wheat or hulled wheat, is a species of wheat cultivated since approximately 5000 BC.
It is one of the grains (along with kamut, brown rice, oats, millet) that I mill in my kitchen for flour when I want to bake something delicious. :mrgreen:
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Re: Why do people give up , instead of provideing details

Postby phenest » 2019-08-31 20:46

Here could be one example of why people give up, and I think it's already been touched upon, is that while we're having this intelligent banter, we are no longer talking about the threads topic any more.

My own experience of peoples behaviour and reactions, is they cannot seem to follow simple instructions. Selective reading (if that's such a thing)? Boredom? Frustration at their own inability? Unable to articulate (that's one I can struggle with)?
One thing they probably share in common, is that they came here knowing they're onto a good thing, not realising they have to learn something. They want you to tell them what to do, so they don't have to learn anything, but have no idea of what to ask because they haven't though about what question to ask. Which probably takes us back to some inability on their part.
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