What is a "Real" Debian User.

If it doesn't relate to Debian, but you still want to share it, please do it here

Postby jml » 2007-11-16 20:19

I agree with one of llivv's comments. Finding just where to read up on a topic to answer a specific question can be a daunting task. Google often gives too many options to review completely, and searching this forum, or FAQ's can turn up a lot of posts that only periferally touch on the topic. (This last bit may reflect more on my poor search skills rather than on the actual forum content.)

One of the best investments I ever made was to actually buy the Debian Bible, and Debian System. They are not perfect, but they are full of a lot of useful information. Just my two cents worth.

Joe
Never meddle in the affairs of dragons, for you are crunchy and good with catsup.
jml
 
Posts: 217
Joined: 2006-10-26 19:51
Location: Albert Lea, Minnesota

Postby Azriel » 2007-11-16 23:40

I have to agree on some points.

Everytime i've changed of distro, i've always passed about a week reading the FM about the distro way of doing things, how should i fix what IS gonna break, and what MIGHT break. And so on. So i never had any trouble installing something new. And i think that's always the way of doing things.

One of the things i head the most concerning Debian, was that i was "a good distro for learning when you have a low-middle unix level", and that is was a "distro of old people who don't like to change, and who don't like the youth who does not have their knowledge", in other words, lot a elitism.

So i switched knowing all that, and i think more of less everything i've read come true. Of course not everyone is an Elitist the way the OP meant it, but i do believe Debian try to keep his user at some level of DIY, and that's how we learn !

If you neither want to learn, or try to do things your way, i see ne reason why you would want to switch to Debian. There are plenty of distro who will be truly happy to welcome new GNU/Linux users, or even some more easy to use. That's the strength of GNU/Linux: you totally have the choice of the quality level the distro expect its users to have, and of the way of doing things.
Azriel
 
Posts: 150
Joined: 2007-07-01 19:03

Postby JohnDeere630 » 2007-11-17 00:21

Just my 2 cents worth....

After reading all the posts in this thread, I think everyone has raised valid points and counterpoints...to each his own; everyone here has their own reasons for using Debian. But one aspect I haven't seen mentioned is one of my own main reasons for preferring Debian: Pride. My very first Linux experience was with Sarge. Each step of the process, from installation, to getting x to run, then getting a desktop environment (Gnome) running, then sound, etc. involved a LOT of Googling, searching forums, etc. Each step mastered was a source of pride and a sense of accomplishment. It took me 2 weeks of on again off again effort, but I got it all running without asking ANY questions. In retrospect that may not have been the most sensible approach, but I sure learned a lot by being forced to dig deep into the guts of the OS. You can't do that with windows, thats for sure. I followed the same approach for MythTV...took me awhile to get it all sorted out, but well worth the effort.
So I guess this all makes me a Real Debian User :P
Maybe what some call elitism is really just pride in choosing the lesser travelled path, and making it take you where you want to go.
JohnDeere630
 
Posts: 637
Joined: 2006-09-02 02:01

Postby mzilikazi » 2007-11-17 01:15

JohnDeere630 wrote:It took me 2 weeks of on again off again effort, but I got it all running without asking ANY questions.

Awesome. :)
Debian Sid Laptops:
AMD Athlon(tm) 64 X2 Dual-Core Processor TK-55 / 1.5G
Intel(R) Pentium(R) Dual CPU T2390 @ 1.86GHz / 3G
User avatar
mzilikazi
Forum Ninja
 
Posts: 3321
Joined: 2004-09-16 02:14
Location: Colorado Springs, CO

Postby lemoicavalier » 2007-11-17 02:50

There are two "requirements" to join Debian that those with an elitist mentality keep bringing up:

1- If you want to be here you should be a person with an inclination towards IT.
2- You need to have more then the basic knowledge of Linux so you can fix stuff once shit hits the fan.

If you can't say "that's me!" to both of those points you shouldn't be using Debian! Go use Mandriva, or you know what? Do not even think about using Linux! Go back to your Windows playpen, you pansy!!!

Well... If say... I don't know... Car companies!... If car companies were to implement a similar grading system to all new car users then I'd probably still be riding a bicycle to work!
I have a) No frelling idea as to how to fix the simples of problems when it comes to my car, and b) I do not want to learn how to do it! I'm not mechanical inclined! If something breaks I go to my grease monkey!

It seems that the elitists are forgetting that not everyone likes/knows how to use Google, or that not everybody wants to know exactly how all the Linux components work! A lot of this new users are normal people who just want to get away from Microsoft's grip! Users that are used to getting a PC at the store with all of the software and drivers already installed! They should be applaud and welcome with open arms for even trying! Hell! Even for asking the questions here instead of using Google!

Besides, can you imagine how boring this place would be if only "Real Debian Users" were to join? Probably the only sub-forum with any kind of activity would be the "off topic" one.

Oh! And you guys really need to get off your high horses, Debian it's no harder to install then any other modern Linux distro out there... Nor is it any harder to add repositories or install drivers! If anything it's easier! I still have nightmares about the horrors of RPM base distros! Just thinking how many problems PLF used to give me back when Mandriva was Mandrake... Ugh! It shivers me penis, I tell ya!

And finally, I'm going to join the bunch of you and tell you why is that I use Debian and no other distro:

- I want to compile as little software as possible!
- I want the bleeding edge!

That's right! I do not give a rat's ass about stability or any of that crap. Hell! For a whole year I was using BLFS if only because with a few, minor modifications I could get the latest KDE and Kernel running...
But then I got bored of having to spend days compiling software. And here I am! "apt-get update && apt-get upgrade"-ing everyday like it's going out of style!... That's how I roll.
Debian Sid, Kernel 2.6.23.8, KDE 3.5.8
I have conquered the holy mountain horizontally!
LeMoi, He whose planet is Venus.
User avatar
lemoicavalier
 
Posts: 446
Joined: 2007-07-22 10:58
Location: Plano, Tx. US of A

Postby Telemachus » 2007-11-17 02:53

Lemoicavalier wrote:Besides, can you imagine how boring this place would be if only "Real Debian Users" were to join? Probably the only sub-forum with any kind of activity would be the "off topic" one.

So, what do you think of Ron Paul?
User avatar
Telemachus
 
Posts: 4677
Joined: 2006-12-25 15:53

Postby CocoAUS » 2007-11-17 03:05

@lemoicavalier

Well said.

Although, openSuSE has one-click installs through the internet, and Ubuntu has the restricted manager. Other than that, I think I agree with your comment 100%.

This whole "real debian user" thing sounds like some high school kids arguing about who's a "real punk" and who's a poser.
User avatar
CocoAUS
 
Posts: 513
Joined: 2007-04-29 08:40

Postby lemoicavalier » 2007-11-17 03:06

Telemachus wrote:
Lemoicavalier wrote:Besides, can you imagine how boring this place would be if only "Real Debian Users" were to join? Probably the only sub-forum with any kind of activity would be the "off topic" one.

So, what do you think of Ron Paul?


Exactly!
Debian Sid, Kernel 2.6.23.8, KDE 3.5.8
I have conquered the holy mountain horizontally!
LeMoi, He whose planet is Venus.
User avatar
lemoicavalier
 
Posts: 446
Joined: 2007-07-22 10:58
Location: Plano, Tx. US of A

Postby Issyer » 2007-11-17 03:06

lemoicavalier wrote: why is that I use Debian and no other distro:

- I want the bleeding edge!

I use Debian because I don't want the bleeding edge.
User avatar
Issyer
 
Posts: 3054
Joined: 2007-05-23 02:59
Location: Khakassia

Postby isilia » 2007-11-17 03:10

Issyer wrote:
lemoicavalier wrote: why is that I use Debian and no other distro:

- I want the bleeding edge!

I use Debian because I don't want the bleeding edge.


I use Debian because then I have lots of choice ^^
Cult of the sitting penguin!
User avatar
isilia
 
Posts: 112
Joined: 2007-11-10 15:31
Location: The Netherlands

Postby Issyer » 2007-11-17 03:18

isilia wrote:I use Debian because then I have lots of choice ^^

That's right. That's why a "Real" Debian User doesn't exist. It's nonsense. Each of us uses Debian his/her own unique way because each of us has his/her own special needs.
User avatar
Issyer
 
Posts: 3054
Joined: 2007-05-23 02:59
Location: Khakassia

Postby txHarleyMan » 2007-11-17 03:19

Telemachus wrote:
Lemoicavalier wrote:Besides, can you imagine how boring this place would be if only "Real Debian Users" were to join? Probably the only sub-forum with any kind of activity would be the "off topic" one.

So, what do you think of Ron Paul?


:lol:
txHarleyMan
Debian Etch
User avatar
txHarleyMan
 
Posts: 390
Joined: 2007-08-06 13:32
Location: Texas

Postby rickh » 2007-11-17 03:56

It may be difficult to define a "real Debian User," but if the request for help starts out....
"I'm running Etch, but I need the latest Nvidia drivers, so I added Lenny and Sid to my sources.list, and now...."

... it ain't one.
Debian-Lenny/Sid 32/64
Desktop: Generic Core 2 Duo, EVGA 680i, Nvidia
Laptop: Generic Intel SIS/AC97
User avatar
rickh
 
Posts: 3473
Joined: 2006-06-29 02:13
Location: Albuquerque, NM USA

Postby Lavene » 2007-11-17 04:45

In the documentary "Revolution OS" Linus says something interesting about operating systems. I don't remember the exact quote but basically he says that an operating system should stay out of the user's way. It should run the programs and take care of the 'inner workings' and not be seen by the user. Basically, a user should not need to interact with the OS it self.

So I guess that if one need to be a 'Real Debian User' to run it, it has failed miserably...
Lavene
Site admin
 
Posts: 5096
Joined: 2006-01-04 04:26
Location: Oslo, Norway

Postby rickh » 2007-11-17 05:57

an operating system should stay out of the user's way. It should run the programs and take care of the 'inner workings' and not be seen by the user. Basically, a user should not need to interact with the OS it self.

So I guess that if one need to be a 'Real Debian User' to run it, it has failed miserably...

Is there a language barrier here? Somehow I don't see any connection between that comment and anything else in the thread. By "OS", I assume Linus was talking about the kernel. If "interacting with the OS" means building your own kernel, or doing anything more complicated than using m-a to build an occasional module, it's way past any ability of mine.
Debian-Lenny/Sid 32/64
Desktop: Generic Core 2 Duo, EVGA 680i, Nvidia
Laptop: Generic Intel SIS/AC97
User avatar
rickh
 
Posts: 3473
Joined: 2006-06-29 02:13
Location: Albuquerque, NM USA

PreviousNext

Return to Offtopic

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 12 guests

fashionable