Win***s vs. Debian

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Lavene · #31 Post by **Lavene** » 2006-12-05 18:39

Guys... please take it easy. This really does not belong here...

Thanks
Tina

DeanLinkous · #32 Post by **DeanLinkous** » 2006-12-05 20:45

Lavene wrote:Guys... please take it easy. This really does not belong here...

Thanks
Tina

Thanks Tina for reminding me where I was. You are correct - something like this REALLY does not belong here. I apologize.

thamarok · #33 Post by **thamarok** » 2006-12-05 21:54

Lavene wrote:Guys... please take it easy. This really does not belong here...

Thanks
Tina

Aren't we guys so sweet when we don't fight against each other?

-> No

ThinkBaz · #34 Post by **ThinkBaz** » 2006-12-05 22:50

Also for your DVD problem "apt-get install libdvdcss2" I have no problem playing Fast & Furious: Toyko Drift which is pretty new, and that disc I've been un-able to copy in either Windows or Linux.

I can play some DVDs of old cartoons. I've loaded every package remotely related to 'libdvdcss.' The error message I get when I load Toy Story is "are you trying to play an encrypted DVD without libdvdcss?"

Maybe this is a bug. I'll likely install the latest "testing" release soon and see if that corrects some of the problems. The one, which concerns me most is the audio CDs freezing the system.

Replica9000 · #35 Post by **Replica9000** » 2006-12-05 23:16

ThinkBaz wrote: I can play some DVDs of old cartoons. I've loaded every package remotely related to 'libdvdcss.' The error message I get when I load Toy Story is "are you trying to play an encrypted DVD without libdvdcss?"

Maybe this is a bug. I'll likely install the latest "testing" release soon and see if that corrects some of the problems. The one, which concerns me most is the audio CDs freezing the system.

I just found Toy Story around my house and I tried playing it in Kaffiene. I works as well as any of my other DVDs. I'm using Debian 3.1 r2 (Sarge) [all the Debian code names are from Toy Story if you didn't know].

The package is definately libdvdcss2. Also check for the packages libdvdread3 , libdvdplay0 and libdvdnav4

DeanLinkous · #36 Post by **DeanLinkous** » 2006-12-06 04:17

Could I ask nicely for a new thread to address the issues this user is having since it isn't really wi***s vs Debian material and I am afraid it may give the wrong impression to someone who wants to compare the two to see a specific users problems that he is having. Thanks if I can, ignore me if I cannot.

Replica9000 · #37 Post by **Replica9000** » 2006-12-06 21:40

DeanLinkous wrote:Could I ask nicely for a new thread to address the issues this user is having since it isn't really wi***s vs Debian material and I am afraid it may give the wrong impression to someone who wants to compare the two to see a specific users problems that he is having. Thanks if I can, ignore me if I cannot.

Holy run-on sentence Batman! Maybe this is just a good example of the support Debian has

. But yeah should be under a different thread.

sargek · #38 Post by **sargek** » 2006-12-06 21:55

Daylung wrote:The only thing windows has over linux is games. Other than that I can't think of anything in windows that's better than linux.

Roger that - Windows is not stable or reliable enough to do anything mission critical, IMHO.

DeanLinkous · #39 Post by **DeanLinkous** » 2006-12-06 21:59

Replica9000 wrote: Holy run-on sentence Batman!

You should of seen it before I hit the EDIT button....whew...!

thamarok · #40 Post by **thamarok** » 2006-12-06 23:13

sargek wrote:
Daylung wrote:The only thing windows has over linux is games. Other than that I can't think of anything in windows that's better than linux.
Roger that - Windows is not stable or reliable enough to do anything mission critical, IMHO.

Maybe, but some stuff I would really like to do in Linux which I can't for now (but maybe in the future but after a looong time):

1. Be able to use a X-Fi card which I got from a friend (yeah, he bought another one for his Window$)

2. To be able to play Megaman X8! This game is getting old and still I can't run it in Wine or Cedega even how much I tweak things and that game used to run on my friend's Window$ 98 PC

3. To be able to play Need for Speed Carbon... Yeah I wanted to buy this game and play it with Cedega, but according to its Game Database, NFS Carbon's playability is zero.

For now, I have only these games emulated through Cedega:

1. Counter-Strike 1.6, Counter-Strike: Condition Zero, Counter-Strike Source
2. Grand Theft Auto: Vice City, Grand Theft Auto: San Andreas
3. VisualBoyAdvance (yeah, the Window$ version is by far better than the Linux one)..
4. Hugo Bukkazoom (sounds a little like I would be a kid, but this game is fun to play even if it costed 15€! It's worth the money

)

And through Wine, I play only Elasto Mania (through Cedega I get some very odd sounds in the game)..

Some native games I play in Linux:
X-Moto (not as good as Elasto Mania, but still fun)
PlanetPenguin Racer (hard, but fun.. but the game music is horrible

)

So yeah, the only advantage of Window$ is more hardware support and more gaming experience. I am thinking of buying Window$ XP and dual-boot it with my Debian box... blame me if you want, but this is the best solution if you want to have Linux while getting the most out of your PC.

Just my 100 bucks and 3 cents =)

Absent Minded · #41 Post by **Absent Minded** » 2007-01-12 12:39

This has definantly been some interesting reading. Linux has been growing on me since the mid-late 90's. Finding debian this last year makes me wish I had found it several years ago. However I may have not been quite ready for it if I had. What a nice listing of Pro's & Con's this thread has been. My arival at linux in it's completeness is owed to me finely getting too fed-up and then just flat out ticked off with MS. I have tried to make porductive comments on simular threads but in the end couldn't post what I came up with because it turned into cr@p by the time I was done... I will try to be more usefull here.

Common:
Both OS's require drivers for whatever hardware you hook up to them.
Both OS's you can use a mamoth amount of both propriatary and open-source software on.
These I am fairly sure we could all agree on.

Points that affect my desired use of these two OS's:
The good:
Windows and Linux both have nice GUI's that I can use relitively easy.
Linux however offers more choices for me to choose from.
Windows and Linux both have fairly good hardware support built in these days.
Thanks to a large support community Linux still supports more hardware than windows dose natively (in my experance).
In Linux I can install whatever I desire to use on my own machine for my own personal use.
I can modify almost all of the software I have availible to suit my needs under Linux.

The Bad:
Windows constantly crashes often do to poorly written hardware drivers, over use of system resources and what apears to be poorly writen, leaky code. This appears to be extreemly pertinante if you build your own system instead of ordering a commercially built, pre-installed system.
In Linux you cannot be a drown or zombi in order to use it unless you have a system admin. This is often the case in Windows as well when you have more than just the usual things to do.
Windows and Linux both lack hardware support for many ADVANCED features built into common hardware. For example WinXX dose not support any of the advanced features on my SBLive audio card. Linux dose better ... supporting most of the advanced features. Sadly both still need propriatary drivers from Creative to make EVERYTHING work.
With my DVD-RW Light-Scribe this story is the same ... excpet I can't even burn an ISO under Win w/o loading costly or handycapt software. CD & DVD software typicaly come standard in a linux distrobution.
In Linux I actually have to READ how to configure my system.
In Win I don't get alot of say in how my programs are setup ... it's generic > one size fits all.
If I want a fairly stable version of Win, I have to pay through the nose and give up my first born to afford it.
And Guess what ... after I have paid for it I am still told what I am allowed to install on it. (That one really T'd me off when I read it)
With every update and new program I recieve from MS ... I get to be insulted and investigated prior to even installing it.
Win no longer supports much of my old hardware as of W2k. I cannot even install propriatary drivers to make them work.
With WinXX when they are done supporting it there goes any security fixes. At least with Linux I have the posibility to write my own if nessary.
This is not realy related to Linux but it is an issue .. many hardware and software venders do not write code for the everyday Linux user. This is differnt in the bussiness world if you are their large account. Just pay them enough and they will do it.

I don't think I will get into the Ugly part ... I have been through some definantly nightmarish things concerning computers though.

But one last thought here: You bought your box and your OS from the same place so they did you a favor ... (you thought) and gave you the OEM copy of WinXX even though it's not pre-installed ... Have you ever tried to get support under those conditions? .... I have and it wasn't a pleasent experiance ... MS did offer me a discount price of $60 an hour though... how good of them.
Here I know where I stand, and it's in good hands of some of the most intelligent people I know.

Carlosinfl · #42 Post by **Carlosinfl** » 2007-01-13 17:40

Windows can do the following:

- Support and play games via DirectX 10.
- Make small children cry when shown it's RAM management.

dmn_clown · #43 Post by **dmn_clown** » 2007-01-16 05:44

more bad:
- Microsoft is contributing to lead, mercury, and an entire host of other nasty chemicals in groundwater leached from disposed hardware that people could no longer use due to the "You must upgrade your hardware to run this software" mentality they have with each new version of their OS.

Lavene · #44 Post by **Lavene** » 2007-01-16 06:57

dmn_clown wrote:more bad:
- Microsoft is contributing to lead, mercury, and an entire host of other nasty chemicals in groundwater leached from disposed hardware that people could no longer use due to the "You must upgrade your hardware to run this software" mentality they have with each new version of their OS.

Naw... that's canceled out by all the Linux users picking up the old hardware so they can downgrade their brand new boxes in order to make them work under Linux.

Tina
PS: Yes, it's just a sarcastic joke... no need to flame me

garrincha · #45 Post by **garrincha** » 2007-01-16 12:33

Lavene wrote: Naw... that's canceled out by all the Linux users picking up the old hardware so they can downgrade their brand new boxes in order to make them work under Linux.

Tina

People will still have hardware problems especially old hardware and corporate interests that use bulk computing (I remember an old friend of mine who picked up a big Silicon Graphic Inc monitor that was dumped in his employer's backyard simply because of a slight crack, he took it home to find it working perfectly). There are literally millions of monitors that have gone "kapputt" or perfectly working ones simply thrown away, and a lot of them sitting in the landfill.

The plastic body can be recycled, while the electronic parts will need a dedicated electronic recycling centre to do the work (all those lead, mercury etc are poisonous). The CRT itself contains mainly phosphors and some inorganic and metallic contamination. I did a group study in 1995 about PCB waste, it seems to me that currently high demand outstrip our ability to recycle electronic waste.

Euro:
Under the Hazardous Waste Regulations implemented in July 2005 all televisions and monitors which contain Cathode Ray Tubes (CRTs) are now classed as hazardous waste and require specialist treatment.

Just don't raise your hope if the oil baron GW Bush decided to reverse his administration's stance on Kyoto Climate Change accord!

Lavene · #46 Post by **Lavene** » 2007-01-16 13:10

In Norway every single store that sell anything electric or electronic is required to take used electric/ electronic equipment for recycling. So I can take everything from used lightbulbs and extension cords to old TV sets and computers to the nearest electro store and they are required by law to take it and deposit it the proper way.

Tina

vit_user · #47 Post by **vit_user** » 2007-01-20 22:31

1 cent from my side: I have to use windows when I do a RAW file converting from my digital SLR camera. There is no such a good RAW converting SW for Linux available, but somebidy could correct my opinion

Br
-Vitali

thamarok · #48 Post by **thamarok** » 2007-01-21 08:37

Check this out:
http://www.linux.com/article.pl?sid=06/08/01/209226
http://www.die.net/doc/linux/man/man1/ufraw.1.html
http://www.galacticslacker.com/Linux_RAW.shtml

Good Luck.

vit_user · #49 Post by **vit_user** » 2007-01-21 12:03

I have compared RAW converting from my 300D with Canon's DPP convertor and UFRAW, installed as Gimp plugin.
The difference is huge - DPP produses noticeably better result.

Maybe good to compare other converters.

factotum218 · #50 Post by **factotum218** » 2007-01-28 18:18

Id have to say the great advantage for me running linux day to day is that it has slowly educated me to understand enough to make comparisons like the original post.

If I would have stuck with windows on my desktop I would still be stuck in a chatroom somewhere trying to find the right app for some outlandish compression or disc image sceme I downloaded off a warez newgroup or p2p.

Im having a lot more fun taking my Mac using Graphic Arts art-student days and throwing them in with css and php and xhtml playing around with web dev and slowly into backend mysql and perl and whatnot. Artisty or plain ol geekeness, its all creative and thats what i like about it.

Debian User Forums

Win***s vs. Debian

My 2yero's worth.