What's the recommended way to get newer kernels on Stable?

New to Debian (Or Linux in general)? Ask your questions here!

What's the recommended way to get newer kernels on Stable?

Postby Gorg » 2020-05-19 20:35

Hi everyone,

I've run Debian successfully on a few servers so far, but one issue holding me back doing so on my home and production machines is the Stable kernel. I'd like to benefit from some driver and filesystem updates (for example Mesa and Btrfs updates for bugfixes, especially in the last year).

What's the recommended way to get newer kernel versions on Stable? (Except for building/installing them myself, which I don't want to do)

Of course, I already found this Wiki-page: https://wiki.debian.org/HowToUpgradeKernel

Now, if I want to take the route of upgrading via repository, which should I chose? The Stable Proposed repository or backports?

If I add "deb http://deb.debian.org/debian/ stable-proposed-updates main" to my sources, will that already upgrade my kernel version automatically on a simple "apt upgrade"? I can't find "stable-proposed-updates" in the packages listing - what kernel version would I be moving to?

In case of backported kernels: Will that play well with the rest of the system or should I consider additional backports besides just the kernel? I don't really need the most brand-new kernel available, but at least a 5.x-kernel could be beneficial at this point.


Kind regards and thank you in advance!
Gorg
 
Posts: 15
Joined: 2019-10-24 09:30

Re: What's the recommended way to get newer kernels on Stabl

Postby kedaha » 2020-05-19 20:55

Hi,
You'll find some information about this, for example at get-linux-kernel-5-3-on-debian-10-stable but perhaps the liquorix kernel would be the best choice.
"Please accept my resignation. I don’t care to belong to any club that will have me as a member".—Groucho Marx
User avatar
kedaha
 
Posts: 3102
Joined: 2008-05-24 12:26

Re: What's the recommended way to get newer kernels on Stabl

Postby CwF » 2020-05-19 21:00

I'm heading for this again too. Always a similar time in the cycle I start reaching for something... This time virtiofs requires 5.4+ in host and guest. In every stage like this, ~3.9 then 4.4+ then 4.10-4.19 I either make them or download and then install it locally...I always have spare machines and images to test so blowing things up never happens!
Maybe this one: https://packages.debian.org/buster-back ... po.2-amd64
CwF
 
Posts: 689
Joined: 2018-06-20 15:16

Re: What's the recommended way to get newer kernels on Stabl

Postby Head_on_a_Stick » 2020-05-19 21:15

Gorg wrote:which should I chose? The Stable Proposed repository or backports?

The proposed-updates repository will only have kernels in the 4.19 series so if you must have a newer kernel then use backports. It's best to stick with the stable kernel if you can though, regressions are unfortunately common in Linux because the developers are too busy cramming in new features to worry about breakages.


That is a poor guide, it only installs a single kernel version which will quickly become outdated and vulnerable.

See viewtopic.php?f=16&t=139003 for the correct method.

kedaha wrote:perhaps the liquorix kernel would be the best choice

That kernel is unsigned and so will not work with Secure Boot enabled, unlike Debian's kernels.
User avatar
Head_on_a_Stick
 
Posts: 12129
Joined: 2014-06-01 17:46
Location: /dev/chair

Re: What's the recommended way to get newer kernels on Stabl

Postby arid » 2020-05-20 01:30

The Wiki told you what to do, so do it! You show some hope of getting to the here and now.

Here's a real kernel on my machines.

Code: Select all
~$ uname -a
Linux test 5.7.0-rc6-siduction-amd64 #1 SMP PREEMPT siduction 5.7~rc6-1~exp1 (2020-05-18) x86_64 GNU/Linux


Yeah, sometimes I like to update to the wild side and use experimental kernels on my sid :evil:
There's no drama in my sid......
arid
 
Posts: 85
Joined: 2014-05-08 18:40
Location: Aridzona

Re: What's the recommended way to get newer kernels on Stabl

Postby Gorg » 2020-05-20 08:43

Thank you all.

Okay, so the only real option here seems to go with the backported kernel then, I thought that the Stable Proposed repository also had newer kernel versions, but it seems like it's just for getting regular Stable updates faster? I'm still a bit confused about that.

Anyway, how safe is it to use just the backported kernel? Of course, corner cases can always show up, but will most systems remain reasonably stable? Or should I also add other backports to ensure stability? (I'm concerned with having a discrepancy between the newer kernel version and older system software, if they interact with eachother in any way)
Gorg
 
Posts: 15
Joined: 2019-10-24 09:30

Re: What's the recommended way to get newer kernels on Stabl

Postby None1975 » 2020-05-20 09:22

Gorg wrote:I thought that the Stable Proposed repository also had newer kernel versions, but it seems like it's just for getting regular Stable updates faster? I'm still a bit confused about that.


According the Debian wiki
Stable-proposed-updates is an apt repository that contains the files that are being prepared for the next Debian/Stable point release.


Also check this https://wiki.debian.org/StableProposedUpdates and this https://www.debian.org/releases/proposed-updates
OS: Debian 10.3 Buster / WM: xmonad
Debian Wiki | DontBreakDebian, My config files on github
User avatar
None1975
 
Posts: 1015
Joined: 2015-11-29 18:23
Location: Lithuania, Vilnius

Re: What's the recommended way to get newer kernels on Stabl

Postby eriefisher » 2020-05-20 10:56

I would do some research. I had trouble with the first of the 5...series kernels. Mostly wifi quit working. I now have a 5.3.... and everything is good. Also have a 5.6.... that works but get some module complaints. Both of these are Siduction kernels. They require gcc10+ and won't install in Buster which has gcc9. The Liquorix kernels will install on Buster no problem but you may not get the results you seek. Maybe you will.

Side note: If you're adding a repo to get a kernel do not apt upgrade. You will everything in that repo. Just apt update then install the kernel and headers you desire and disable the repo.
Last edited by eriefisher on 2020-05-20 15:57, edited 1 time in total.
____________________________________________
There's a manual?

(0||||0)
User avatar
eriefisher
 
Posts: 103
Joined: 2008-06-04 03:49
Location: Ontario's South Coast

Re: What's the recommended way to get newer kernels on Stabl

Postby Head_on_a_Stick » 2020-05-20 14:55

Gorg wrote:will most systems remain reasonably stable? Or should I also add other backports to ensure stability?

The kernel is pretty self-contained and it is generally recommended to limit packages from backports to as few as possible.

eriefisher wrote:Both of these are Siduction kernels. They require gcc10+ and won't install in Buster which has gcc9

The kernel itself should be installable but the user might not be able to build any custom kernel modules, that's all, and I'm sure our OP isn't a heathen :mrgreen:

eriefisher wrote:If your adding a repo to get a kernel do not apt upgrade. You will everything in that repo. Just apt update then install the kernel and headers you desire and disable the repo.

That's a really bad idea because then the kernel will never be updated and will quickly accumulate known vulnerabilities. Also, 's/your/you're/'.
User avatar
Head_on_a_Stick
 
Posts: 12129
Joined: 2014-06-01 17:46
Location: /dev/chair

Re: What's the recommended way to get newer kernels on Stabl

Postby eriefisher » 2020-05-20 16:02

Head_on_a_Stick wrote:
eriefisher wrote:If your adding a repo to get a kernel do not apt upgrade. You will everything in that repo. Just apt update then install the kernel and headers you desire and disable the repo.

That's a really bad idea because then the kernel will never be updated and will quickly accumulate known vulnerabilities. Also, 's/your/you're/'.

If you want to remain in buster/stable I would not add a siduction repo and dist-upgrade or full-upgrade. That would apply to any repo, although, the Liquorix repo should only bring in the kernel and be able to upgrade it through the meta package.

You, your, you're etc fixed, Thanks
____________________________________________
There's a manual?

(0||||0)
User avatar
eriefisher
 
Posts: 103
Joined: 2008-06-04 03:49
Location: Ontario's South Coast

Re: What's the recommended way to get newer kernels on Stabl

Postby Head_on_a_Stick » 2020-05-20 16:27

eriefisher wrote:If you want to remain in buster/stable I would not add a siduction repo and dist-upgrade or full-upgrade.

Yes, adding the siduction repositories would be a silly idea. But so is installing a single kernel version from there. The buster-backports repository is the best approach.

eriefisher wrote:the Liquorix repo should only bring in the kernel and be able to upgrade it through the meta package

Liquorix now supply a specific Debian buster repository but it won't work with Secure Boot, as I mentioned earlier.
User avatar
Head_on_a_Stick
 
Posts: 12129
Joined: 2014-06-01 17:46
Location: /dev/chair

Re: What's the recommended way to get newer kernels on Stabl

Postby CwF » 2020-05-20 17:31

Head_on_a_Stick wrote:Yes, adding the siduction repositories would be a silly idea


Really adding any repository is silly. Just download the deb and gdebi it in, works for me. CLI apt install it if you insist. It's not difficult to then manually update if needed. The one I listed should be the obvious choice. We do need to pay attention to large differences the kernel could be compiled against, gcc was mentioned. The one I listed is for buster, is 5.4, fits the requirement...The old kernel will still be in place for recovery if needed until you manually remove it. This isn't difficult.
CwF
 
Posts: 689
Joined: 2018-06-20 15:16

Re: What's the recommended way to get newer kernels on Stabl

Postby Head_on_a_Stick » 2020-05-20 17:41

CwF wrote:It's not difficult to then manually update if needed.

And how would the OP know when an upgrade was needed? How do you propose that they keep abreast of the new kernel vulnerabilities that are found?
User avatar
Head_on_a_Stick
 
Posts: 12129
Joined: 2014-06-01 17:46
Location: /dev/chair

Re: What's the recommended way to get newer kernels on Stabl

Postby CwF » 2020-05-20 17:54

If one has the wherewithal to identify a need for a kernel beyond stable I expect them to be able to determine these things, that's how. The sudden appearance of bpo.3 might be a clue. This isn't rocket surgery.
CwF
 
Posts: 689
Joined: 2018-06-20 15:16

Re: What's the recommended way to get newer kernels on Stabl

Postby Head_on_a_Stick » 2020-05-20 17:55

CwF wrote:This isn't rocket surgery.

Well no but it's certainly a whole lot easier to just use the buster-backports repository...
User avatar
Head_on_a_Stick
 
Posts: 12129
Joined: 2014-06-01 17:46
Location: /dev/chair

Next

Return to Beginners Questions

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 5 guests

fashionable