Laptop crashes if left idle too long

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Laptop crashes if left idle too long

Postby debian_fmx » 2009-11-26 21:40

Hello everyone.

As the title of the thread reads, my laptop (and desktop for that matter) crashes after it is idle for a while.

I have researched Google for some time and nothing has given me a straight answer.

I've also searched the Debian forum and nothing specific has popped up.

I want to try and debug this but I don't know where to start.

Any help on this matter would be appreciated.

Thank you!

Note: I have encountered this issue on x86 and x86-64 versions of Debian Lenny.
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Re: Laptop crashes if left idle too long

Postby Romane » 2009-11-27 00:42

Good morning

Well, to start with we need more information. "It crashes" gives no indication to anyone what might be causing the issue and as a diagnostic tool is about as useful as an ashtray on a motorbike. At some point some will ask for log files - we'll leave it for then for them to ask and to tell you how to get the ones they need to see. One step at a time...

Please describe as well as you can how the computer crashes. Just describe the full sequence of events - from that description someone with expertise may be able to ascertain which may be the relevant log files and so begin the course of getting the beastie running smoothly.

And if you can - what hardware are you running this on. Lenny (and Squeeze too, for that matter) runs on lots of different hardware from ancient to very modern straight out of the box, so to speak, but it may be that with your beastie something needs special tweaking.

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Re: Laptop crashes if left idle too long

Postby debian_fmx » 2009-11-27 05:16

Hello!

So, I ran lspci -k in the laptop and got the following:

Code: Select all
00:00.0 Host bridge: ATI Technologies Inc RS480 Host Bridge (rev 01)
00:01.0 PCI bridge: ATI Technologies Inc RS480 PCI Bridge
   Kernel modules: shpchp
00:13.0 USB Controller: ATI Technologies Inc IXP SB400 USB Host Controller
   Kernel driver in use: ohci_hcd
   Kernel modules: ohci-hcd
00:13.1 USB Controller: ATI Technologies Inc IXP SB400 USB Host Controller
   Kernel driver in use: ohci_hcd
   Kernel modules: ohci-hcd
00:13.2 USB Controller: ATI Technologies Inc IXP SB400 USB2 Host Controller
   Kernel driver in use: ehci_hcd
   Kernel modules: ehci-hcd
00:14.0 SMBus: ATI Technologies Inc IXP SB400 SMBus Controller (rev 11)
   Kernel driver in use: piix4_smbus
   Kernel modules: i2c-piix4
00:14.1 IDE interface: ATI Technologies Inc IXP SB400 IDE Controller
   Kernel driver in use: ATIIXP_IDE
   Kernel modules: atiixp, ide-pci-generic, ata_generic
00:14.3 ISA bridge: ATI Technologies Inc IXP SB400 PCI-ISA Bridge
00:14.4 PCI bridge: ATI Technologies Inc IXP SB400 PCI-PCI Bridge
00:14.5 Multimedia audio controller: ATI Technologies Inc IXP SB400 AC'97 Audio Controller (rev 02)
   Kernel driver in use: ATI IXP AC97 controller
   Kernel modules: snd-atiixp
00:14.6 Modem: ATI Technologies Inc SB400 AC'97 Modem Controller (rev 02)
   Kernel driver in use: ATI IXP MC97 controller
   Kernel modules: snd-atiixp-modem
00:18.0 Host bridge: Advanced Micro Devices [AMD] K8 [Athlon64/Opteron] HyperTransport Technology Configuration
00:18.1 Host bridge: Advanced Micro Devices [AMD] K8 [Athlon64/Opteron] Address Map
00:18.2 Host bridge: Advanced Micro Devices [AMD] K8 [Athlon64/Opteron] DRAM Controller
00:18.3 Host bridge: Advanced Micro Devices [AMD] K8 [Athlon64/Opteron] Miscellaneous Control
   Kernel driver in use: k8temp
   Kernel modules: k8temp
01:05.0 VGA compatible controller: ATI Technologies Inc Radeon XPRESS 200M 5955 (PCIE)
   Kernel modules: radeonfb
05:00.0 Ethernet controller: Realtek Semiconductor Co., Ltd. RTL-8139/8139C/8139C+ (rev 10)
   Kernel driver in use: 8139too
   Kernel modules: 8139too, 8139cp
05:02.0 Network controller: Broadcom Corporation BCM4318 [AirForce One 54g] 802.11g Wireless LAN Controller (rev 02)
   Kernel driver in use: b43-pci-bridge
   Kernel modules: ssb
05:09.0 CardBus bridge: Texas Instruments PCIxx21/x515 Cardbus Controller
   Kernel driver in use: yenta_cardbus
   Kernel modules: yenta_socket
05:09.2 FireWire (IEEE 1394): Texas Instruments OHCI Compliant IEEE 1394 Host Controller
   Kernel driver in use: ohci1394
   Kernel modules: ohci1394
05:09.3 Mass storage controller: Texas Instruments PCIxx21 Integrated FlashMedia Controller
   Kernel driver in use: tifm_7xx1
   Kernel modules: tifm_7xx1
05:09.4 SD Host controller: Texas Instruments PCI6411/6421/6611/6621/7411/7421/7611/7621 Secure Digital Controller
   Kernel driver in use: sdhci
   Kernel modules: sdhci


Also, ran lspci -k just in case it would be of more use to show which kernel drivers are taking care of what.

Thanks!
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Re: Laptop crashes if left idle too long

Postby Romane » 2009-11-27 12:41

Good morning

debian_fmx wrote:So, I ran lspci -k in the laptop and got the following:
<---snip--->


Ok, good start. Now to describe what it does when it crashes, how it crashes. Does it lock up? does it give funny messages? Does it go blank. What do you need to do to get it back up and running. And so on. Which someone with greater experience than myself (fairly new at this as well) can use to set their thinking bits in motion and start the process of working out what is going on.

With greeting

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Re: Laptop crashes if left idle too long

Postby Pick2 » 2009-11-27 15:38

I would be willing to bet it has something to do with going into suspend mode. or to sleep. Try disabling them. ( I know not how to do it )
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Re: Laptop crashes if left idle too long

Postby debian_fmx » 2009-12-14 01:06

Hello,

Sorry for the delay.

Basically the problem stopped.

I disabled suspend and sleep and also disabled "screen lock when idle".

I don't know if that fixed the issue or if a software update fixed it.

Anyhow, thank you all for your responses.

If it happens again, I will let you know.
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Re: Laptop crashes if left idle too long

Postby jheaton5 » 2009-12-16 18:09

I'm with pic2. This was a power management issue. It waws not a bug, you just had your settings set to go into suspend when you didn't want it to. I'm glad you got it resolved.
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Re: Laptop crashes if left idle too long

Postby cnoyes » 2009-12-25 15:43

It comes from one of two sources.....in my experience. Either Power managemen(ACPI) or your X configuration. Either way, getting rid of suspend/resume and the like isn't a solution, it's like Aspirin, it will mask a fever, not cure the condition causing it. If you want to find out if it's fixed or not, turn those settings back on. Unfortunately, your Hardware configuration is the exact opposite of what I'm used to, I always use Intel, and I always use Nvidia, so I can't be of much use to you in troubleshooting if it's your X confguration. I may get arguments about the possibility of it being X(either drivers, kernel modules, or configuration), but ACPI works directly with the power management of your graphics card, so any small issues with your configuration can waterfall into a crash when it changes states. Anyway, none of this is all tha helpful, but I thought the discussion should continue in the interest of actually diagnosing the issue, in the event other users happen onto this thread with similar/same issues.
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Re: Laptop crashes if left idle too long

Postby jheaton5 » 2009-12-25 20:02

cnoyes wrote:It comes from one of two sources.....in my experience. Either Power managemen(ACPI) or your X configuration. Either way, getting rid of suspend/resume and the like isn't a solution, it's like Aspirin, it will mask a fever, not cure the condition causing it. If you want to find out if it's fixed or not, turn those settings back on. Unfortunately, your Hardware configuration is the exact opposite of what I'm used to, I always use Intel, and I always use Nvidia, so I can't be of much use to you in troubleshooting if it's your X confguration. I may get arguments about the possibility of it being X(either drivers, kernel modules, or configuration), but ACPI works directly with the power management of your graphics card, so any small issues with your configuration can waterfall into a crash when it changes states. Anyway, none of this is all tha helpful, but I thought the discussion should continue in the interest of actually diagnosing the issue, in the event other users happen onto this thread with similar/same issues.


OK, fine. Lead him down a dark alley and abandon him. Chances are great that the issue has to do with the power settings and him not knowing how to come out of suspend. If you are going to tell him to reset his power management at least tell him what to do when it goes into suspend.
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Re: Laptop crashes if left idle too long

Postby cnoyes » 2009-12-25 20:20

jheaton5 wrote:
cnoyes wrote:It comes from one of two sources.....in my experience. Either Power managemen(ACPI) or your X configuration. Either way, getting rid of suspend/resume and the like isn't a solution, it's like Aspirin, it will mask a fever, not cure the condition causing it. If you want to find out if it's fixed or not, turn those settings back on. Unfortunately, your Hardware configuration is the exact opposite of what I'm used to, I always use Intel, and I always use Nvidia, so I can't be of much use to you in troubleshooting if it's your X confguration. I may get arguments about the possibility of it being X(either drivers, kernel modules, or configuration), but ACPI works directly with the power management of your graphics card, so any small issues with your configuration can waterfall into a crash when it changes states. Anyway, none of this is all that helpful, but I thought the discussion should continue in the interest of actually diagnosing the issue, in the event other users happen onto this thread with similar/same issues.


OK, fine. Lead him down a dark alley and abandon him. Chances are great that the issue has to do with the power settings and him not knowing how to come out of suspend. If you are going to tell him to reset his power management at least tell him what to do when it goes into suspend.


Fair enough. However, it clearly is a bug. And bugs aren't a hardware issue, so lspci isn't going to diagnose how his OS deals with the information contained in it, though knowing what hardware he has is important as there is hardware that is known to have issues in Debian. At worse, trying to turn power management features back on will cause the original problem to come back, which he clearly knows how to deal with. At best, it may turn out that he can now suspend, resume, etc. at a fully functional level. Fully functional is where we should be striving to get, if someone's email doesn't work, you don't tell them to uninstall their email client as a solution, you try to diagnose what's happening, form a consensus, and then instruct the user what if anything he can do to get his email back up and running. That's all I was doing, ok turning it off makes the problem go away, but if you turn it back on, does the problem come back? No, ok, what in your system changed between the time you saw the problem and the time you noticed it was gone? Ok, it must be xyz that fixed it. Fast forward a month, a user has the same issue, now they can find the solution in this thread. That as I previously stated was the reason I wanted to continue the discussion.
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Re: Laptop crashes if left idle too long

Postby julian67 » 2009-12-25 20:31

Not necessarily a software bug. 3D/OpenGL Screensavers can be very CPU intensive. That makes the CPU heat up. If there is a problem with the cooling of the laptop then *crash* it shuts down to prevent damage. If it was my machine I'd inspect the vents, both in and out flowing, for obstruction. It's not unusual to find them full of fluff, and I've solved a similar mysterious crashing problem for one person by moving the large dictionary they kept by the side of their laptop...it completely blocked the exhaust vent :D I'd also remove the casing and inspect the cooling fan for crud and to make sure it actually spins.
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Re: Laptop crashes if left idle too long

Postby cnoyes » 2009-12-25 20:41

julian67 wrote:Not necessarily a software bug. 3D/OpenGL Screensavers can be very CPU intensive. That makes the CPU heat up. If there is a problem with the cooling of the laptop then *crash* it shuts down to prevent damage. If it was my machine I'd inspect the vents, both in and out flowing, for obstruction. It's not unusual to find them full of fluff, and I've solved a similar mysterious crashing problem for one person by moving the large dictionary they kept by the side of their laptop...it completely blocked the exhaust vent :D I'd also remove the casing and inspect the cooling fan for crud and to make sure it actually spins.


Actually, that's a really good point that I hadn't even considered. I have an Antec 900 case, so I take venting for granted.
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