Systemd to sysv-init

Kernels & Hardware, configuring network, installing services

Systemd to sysv-init

Postby runfrodorun » 2014-03-08 15:44

Hi, I noticed that Debian has switched to systemd, or at least that's what it appears to me. I have very little experience dealing with init systems, but I have some qualms about the design philosophy of systemd, and I would like to reinstall sysv-init.

I have some questions before I do this:
1. Since systemd, if it is running on my system, is in full sysv compatibility, theoretically all I have to do is install the sysv-init package and remove systemd? Is this correct or not?
2. Do you think there will be a point where sysv-init will be completely unsupported by the software images in the repository and will need to be manually configured?
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Re: Systemd to sysv-init

Postby dibl » 2014-03-08 23:46

runfrodorun wrote:I have some questions before I do this:
1. Since systemd, if it is running on my system, is in full sysv compatibility, theoretically all I have to do is install the sysv-init package and remove systemd? Is this correct or not?


Code: Select all
# apt-get remove --purge systemd libpam-systemd systemd-sysv


Code: Select all
# apt-get install sysv-init


runfrodorun wrote:2. Do you think there will be a point where sysv-init will be completely unsupported by the software images in the repository and will need to be manually configured?


Yes.
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Re: Systemd to sysv-init

Postby llivv » 2014-03-09 03:55

runfrodorun wrote:2. Do you think there will be a point where sysv-init will be completely unsupported by the software images in the repository and will need to be manually configured?

for gnome and xfces gnome deps, yes
kde not so much, AFAICT

be careful if using gnome and try to remove systemd
it may throw a few surprises your way.
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Re: Systemd to sysv-init

Postby confuseling » 2014-03-09 18:18

Re: 2, it's very unlikely that SysVinit will continue to be supported, because writing init scripts for SysVinit is hard work, and if it isn't used as the default on Linux they'll rot.

*If* (and it isn't certain) the other ports survive though, they'll probably do so using another init, and if the support is there it should probably work in Linux too. In other words eventually you may have another viable init (presumably OpenRC?), but it doesn't look likely it'll be SysVinit.
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Re: Systemd to sysv-init

Postby runfrodorun » 2014-03-24 17:39

Thanks for all your answers guys, that was really helpful and I appreciate your honesty. A big part of me just says forget about it and deal with it, but I'm all about having that choice. At the same time though, it's not like I want there to be a bajillion more forks of debian just for the sake of having a different init system.

I've also heard that udev will eventually be fully integrated with systemd so I guess that's another consideration to make, since it can be very nice sometimes (and also aweful when it doesn't work)

Since I'm on jessie I guess I should probably stick with systemd because a lot of these changes are getting pushed onto my system and I'll probably end up bricking my installation before long if I'm not careful :P

But yeah, thanks for the answers that was very informative.
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Re: Systemd to sysv-init

Postby goulo » 2014-03-24 18:46

runfrodorun: FWIW, I share your concerns about systemd; if/when systemd becomes mandatory in Debian sid, that will be sufficient motivation for me to move to Gentoo (one of the few Linuxes which is not moving to require systemd) or to FreeBSD, if I haven't already.
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Re: Systemd to sysv-init

Postby runfrodorun » 2014-03-25 15:47

I've used gentoo some in the past. Most of my friends run it, and it's nice that it has OpenRC, but debian has been my favorite distribution for a long time; I guess I'm willing to look over a few issues that I don't agree with. The other option you have is to run the FreeBSD flavor of debian, which by definition I don't think can have systemd because the developers are hostile to supporting BSD kernels.
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