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Additions/changes to forum rules

Code of conduct, suggestions, and information on forums.debian.net.
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konfiguros
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Re: Additions/changes to forum rules

#21 Post by konfiguros »

mzilikazi wrote:
konfiguros wrote:I specialy like the above numbah 3 mzilikazi. Sum excitable kids likes to role play on tat one me thinks. Adults of course aint got no time nor desire fer such frivalous activty.
Since I've seen other posts where you've demonstrated a fine grasp of the English language I can only assume this non-English is meant to confuse those of us that only speak English. I cannot read whatever it is you typed and it was painful to even try.
What I was saying is there are many socially anxious and lonely kids out there and if Debian and the forums and the internet in general make them happy then let them be.

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mzilikazi
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Re: Additions/changes to forum rules

#22 Post by mzilikazi »

nadir wrote:
c) It might be an idea to hire mods which are able to understand the rules and which are able to stand on their own feet.
Hire? To hire implies a form of payment.

You also say that moderators cannot stand on their own two feet yet when a moderator does enforce a rule (stands on their own 2 feet) that also elicits a complaint. Someone is always going to be irritated no matter what happens.
d) Thinking of "we" and "them", not of us.
That's exactly right - we should be think of ALL users not just those that have spent their entire lives learning about how Debian works and expect everyone else to have done the same.
e) The usual behavior between humans is to ask.
Not to say: i am a moderator, i don't like that and that, i will change it ( the post).
If one wants that one needs to pay people. Those you can tell what to do, without further discussion
Again you are off base - if you want someone to hold your hand through every little grievance, investigate every complaint and read 100 threads to "get to the bottom of it all" then YOU need to pay someone for that. The rules are what they are and you are free to dislike them all you want.
(they are known as slaves. A time which is long gone, and i am not sure why a forum for free-software is build on such rules.
That it is common does not make it any better)
Really - you want to speak of slavery? No one is forced to be here. The moderators are all volunteers that dedicate what time they have. You are here voluntarily as well.
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Re: Additions/changes to forum rules

#23 Post by mzilikazi »

mharrison wrote:And here lies the problem, as Nadir said. If the mods do not simply have the desire or the time to be the judge and jury, then perhaps we need mods who do have the time. I understand this is a volunteer based system, however you can't bitch about us bringing down the forum when you are admitting that you don't have the time to do your job. If it is that hard then step down and find someone else to do it who does have the time.
So let's see....if there's just too much for a small group to handle then the obvious solution is for that group to quit? Sorry if I can't follow your logic. Do we need more mods/admins? Perhaps, but when you ridicule the existing mods/admins I doubt that many volunteers will be forthcoming.
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Re: Additions/changes to forum rules

#24 Post by mzilikazi »

llivv wrote:because it's a waste of everyones time.

removing all the new rules is another step in the right direction.

I for one am a bit disappointed....

If there is going to be civility in this forum,
someone is going to have remove of offending rules..
No need to ask what they are, just start removing them...
You'll know when enough of them have been purged..
I would imagine that all of the rules offend at least someone.
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Re: Additions/changes to forum rules

#25 Post by mzilikazi »

Mr James wrote:"This is why the problems occur."
Some people can't handle it (old users and new).
As a long time Debian user I can confirm that the Debian IRC channel was one of the absolute worst places for anyone to go for assistance unless you were already an experienced user. This is what it seems that you are requesting - that forums.debian.net only cater to experienced users. I don't see that happening.
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Re: Additions/changes to forum rules

#26 Post by mzilikazi »

nadir wrote: btw: Starting such a thread and then letting it die in No-mans-land (aka Wasteland) is not a proof of "this is your forum".
But things seem to take very long over here...while the banning/editing/removing works in the blink of an eye.[/size]
Where are you from that you think everything happens in the course of an hour or two? Starting a thread like this and then ending it after a day would have hardly been enough time to get some decent feedback.
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Re: Additions/changes to forum rules

#27 Post by mzilikazi »

konfiguros wrote:
mzilikazi wrote:
konfiguros wrote:I specialy like the above numbah 3 mzilikazi. Sum excitable kids likes to role play on tat one me thinks. Adults of course aint got no time nor desire fer such frivalous activty.
Since I've seen other posts where you've demonstrated a fine grasp of the English language I can only assume this non-English is meant to confuse those of us that only speak English. I cannot read whatever it is you typed and it was painful to even try.
What I was saying is there are many socially anxious and lonely kids out there and if Debian and the forums and the internet in general make them happy then let them be.
Thanks for clarification - this I can understand perfectly.
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Re: Additions/changes to forum rules

#28 Post by mzilikazi »

There will always be new users.
Some users (new and experienced alike) will always say something that irritates someone else.
I don't see the Beginners section going away. If you don't want to read the threads in that section then don't - it really is that simple.

This community is much like the Debian Social Contract, alot of which I think applies here at forums.debian.net, especially these parts:

We will give back to the free software community

We will not hide problems

Our priorities are our users and free software

No Discrimination Against Persons or Groups

No Discrimination Against Fields of Endeavor


Try asking yourself "What am I here for?" If your answer is not similar to the above then perhaps you have the wrong forum.

As far as I can see there is no need for any changes to the rules. BTW - the suggested changes came directly from yet another disgruntled forum member - even those of you that don't like the way things are done here cannot agree on how it should be done.
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Re: Additions/changes to forum rules

#29 Post by nadir »

mzilikazi wrote:Now's your chance to speak up and make your suggestions about the existing forum guidelines
It's everyone's forum - what should the future look like?
I told you what i think. Then you say:
mzilikazi wrote: The rules are what they are and you are free to dislike them all you want.
Might well be i am off base.
A lot of people seem to be.
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Mr James
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Re: Additions/changes to forum rules

#30 Post by Mr James »

mzilikazi wrote:This is what it seems that you are requesting - that forums.debian.net only cater to experienced users. I don't see that happening.
I said no such thing. Go back and re-read my posts in this thread, especially the first.
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Re: Additions/changes to forum rules

#31 Post by mzilikazi »

nadir wrote: I told you what i think. Then you say:
mzilikazi wrote: The rules are what they are and you are free to dislike them all you want.
Yes perhaps I was rather blunt. Allow me to elaborate.
None of the suggested forum rule changes really amounted to much. These things are mostly covered under the existing rules. Perhaps some minor adjustments are in order but I don't see an urgent need for anything drastic to take place with the forum rules as they are.
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Re: Additions/changes to forum rules

#32 Post by nadir »

mzilikazi wrote:
nadir wrote: I told you what i think. Then you say:
mzilikazi wrote: The rules are what they are and you are free to dislike them all you want.
Yes perhaps I was rather blunt. Allow me to elaborate.
None of the suggested forum rule changes really amounted to much. These things are mostly covered under the existing rules. Perhaps some minor adjustments are in order but I don't see an urgent need for anything drastic to take place with the forum rules as they are.
I think i hear you.
I said in my first post: i got problems to express myself. Language _is a problem for me.
I guess we mainly agree, but got problems to understand each other (error on my side of the river).

In the terms of the Debian-social-contract my concern is the freedom of speech.
I for one see "posts" as the intellectual property of the one who wrote them. Hence any "editing" should be done if, and only if, absolutely necessary. A minimum of being able to understand things should be required to be a moderator or admin, not the pure will to simply ~do something~.

As long i have been a member of this board (2 years +, not long) there have been rules. But they have not been a "holy cow". The important thing were the users and the board, not the rules itself.
Now wherever i go: each subsection and my users-control-panel and the posts of a certain mod: all i see are rules. In lynx the complete first page i see are rules-threads.

sorry that i am not able to speak in plain words.
best of luck
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Re: Additions/changes to forum rules

#33 Post by mzilikazi »

nadir wrote: In the terms of the Debian-social-contract my concern is the freedom of speech.
I for one see "posts" as the intellectual property of the one who wrote them. Hence any "editing" should be done if, and only if, absolutely necessary. A minimum of being able to understand things should be required to be a moderator or admin, not the pure will to simply ~do something~.
Indeed - free speech is king.
As for me, the posts I've edited were either completely off-topic or offensive. I'm not even sure I have edited any 'offensive' posts but definitely I have edited offtopic posts. I think it unfair to lock a thread because someone other than the OP is posting off-topic. The posts I recall editing were attempts to express the opinion of the poster but had nothing to do with the thread. In these cases nothing was lost since the post that was edited had no bearing at all on the topic.
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Re: Additions/changes to forum rules

#34 Post by mharrison »

mzilikazi wrote:
mharrison wrote:And here lies the problem, as Nadir said. If the mods do not simply have the desire or the time to be the judge and jury, then perhaps we need mods who do have the time. I understand this is a volunteer based system, however you can't bitch about us bringing down the forum when you are admitting that you don't have the time to do your job. If it is that hard then step down and find someone else to do it who does have the time.
So let's see....if there's just too much for a small group to handle then the obvious solution is for that group to quit? Sorry if I can't follow your logic. Do we need more mods/admins? Perhaps, but when you ridicule the existing mods/admins I doubt that many volunteers will be forthcoming.
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Mr James
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Re: Additions/changes to forum rules

#35 Post by Mr James »

mzilikazi wrote:I think it unfair to lock a thread because someone other than the OP is posting off-topic
Tell that to Mez - he locks threads even when everyone IS on topic.
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Re: Additions/changes to forum rules

#36 Post by traveler »

Comment removed.
Last edited by traveler on 2011-03-10 13:30, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Additions/changes to forum rules

#37 Post by llivv »

removed - electrons unwanted
Last edited by llivv on 2011-03-10 16:18, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: Additions/changes to forum rules

#38 Post by mharrison »

llivv wrote:post reported as wasting forum electrons...
"obviously" your definition of a personal attack and my definition of the same differ ever so slightly...
Posting that you reported a post is also indeed a waste of forum electrons. Do you want a cookie for reporting a post? Is that why you advertised it?

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