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Where will you go after systemd?

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Where will you go after systemd?

BSD
12
16%
Linux without systemd
34
47%
Mac
2
3%
Windows
0
No votes
something totally different
1
1%
have not decided yet
24
33%
 
Total votes: 73

Message
Author
schnuller
Posts: 386
Joined: 2014-11-25 05:05

Re: Where will you go after systemd?

#161 Post by schnuller »

tomazzi wrote:
schnuller wrote:I thought the question was what software you already did write, not what software you are planning to write.
And I thought that arguments, especially technical arguments are speaking for themselves - it's You who have a problem here, so You are trying to qestion my competence, because You can't understand the arguments nor the portions of code which I've posted here. So I could ask : are You just trolling here?, but I'm not going to say this ;) (well, I've said this, sorry)

Anyway, since I don't have google+ account nor Facepalm account, I can't give You a link to my profile, and for sure I will not show You my CV (You wouldn't understand most of it, cause there are mostly technical terms).
However, I may tell You that I'm working embedded systems/software in the area of factory automation (servo controllers, PLCs, etc).
In case if by "embedded system" You can only imagine toys like RaspberryPi, (what is rather common picture among laics), then I'll surprise You: "a toy" like S7-319F PLC is build on 3 independant CPUs: TriCore, PMC E9 and ERTEC400 (dedicated ethernet controller with integrated ARM core for handling Profibus and ProfiNet stacks).
Not sure why you consider a simple question as offence or as trolling. And the question was asked humble and friendly enough. It statet from the very beginning that it *might* clarify things.
What do google+ or facebook have to do with software development? github or similar would be more close to it.


Normally this should be end of this post, but I do uderstand that You believe in some magic or some super powers owned by developers who are working for big-name companies. Well I'm going to show You something:
I didn't speak of companies at all. You got a quote where it may have sounded as if i was speaking of companies or a CV?

It is very exhausting to speak to you, as you seem to misunderstand everything. Then quickly rant bout others having no technical backround or knowledge.
I wonder how it may be that none of the thousands of Debian Developers and Maintainers has a clue of C programming.
And if the code of systemd would be as close to perfect as it could be, i still wouldn't use it, as i dislike it's general approach.

tomazzi
Posts: 730
Joined: 2013-08-02 21:33

Re: Where will you go after systemd?

#162 Post by tomazzi »

Hmm, maybe I've becomed "hypersensitive", after reading stupid comments from that jerk who's hiding under the nick "Deb-fan"...

I didn't said that others have no technical knowledge - that funny example of EDID is just showing that Big Name doesn't necessarily make anyone an oracle. Everyone makes mistakes, there are no exceptions. The only difference is in how are You going to deal with the mistakes You've made.
And this is exactly the problem with systemd: I'm entirely sure that the devs know perfectly what is broken in the design of this project, but they have decided to silently ignore this (that's probably because it would need some important changes, some work, and many tests - or because they just have some other targets)

Anyway, it showed up, that in the end it's me who's stupid:
Because non-technical arguments are widely ignored, I've tried to show technical side of the problem. That in turn showed up to be stupid, because I was accused of being non-competent to raise such arguments - and what is funny, by people who knows crap about software.

Maybe You will understand me, maybe not - anyway, I'll just continue to do my work, and I'll make the results available for review/download.

Regards.
Odi profanum vulgus

schnuller
Posts: 386
Joined: 2014-11-25 05:05

Re: Where will you go after systemd?

#163 Post by schnuller »

I think i do understand you. I also think i did understand you from the beginning (which is way before this thread).
I do apppreciate your aproach from a code-related point of view. Seriously.
But:
1)I and many others don't understand it (while i learned a bit of C, what you speak of is way above me).
2) I doubted and still doubt that there are only technical arguments against systemd (takeover by RedHat and "do-one-thing-do-it-well" are still technical arguments in my world, but not as technical as code-related arguments).

Seriously: No offense from my side. I speak the way i speak, and it is weird (no need to be hypersensitive to misunderstand it ... :-) ). But my intention was never to disagree with your general approach. I only tried to show that other approaches are kinda valid too.

But yes, the whole systemd "discussion" (lol) is like a circus (Deb-fan, etc). Paranoia mixed with hysterie, never-ending rants, but most of all: wrong info.

Long story short: Good luck and, as far it's me, everything is fine.
At the end of the day systemd is there, in Debian, and i will have to live with it, i will have to make my choices. No matter what is the outcome of discussions.

debianized
Posts: 278
Joined: 2009-01-07 07:56

Re: Where will you go after systemd?

#164 Post by debianized »

ILC77 wrote:I think that I am going to go with Gentoo.
I wish you luck. Gentoo was great in the early days. It's an absolute abortion now. It has become this huge bureaucracy and it shows. Back in early 2009, Gentoo stable packages were even older than Debian stable, which is why I switched to Debian then.

Speaking of Gentoo, I remember the high drama which occurred on the Gentoo forums back when systemd was first discussed. People lost their damn minds. Talk about spreading FUD, except it was systemd FUD. I'm a bit surprised to see the same FUD spread on these forums now. I had always assumed the forum members here were beyond it. I guessed wrong apparently.

I happily run Parabola and KaOS here, both with systemd. I've yet to experience so much as a hiccup on either system.

Deb-fan
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Re: Where will you go after systemd?

#165 Post by Deb-fan »

Yeah ... I'm hiding great tomazzi :D Sheesh, would pay $ to have 20mins to talk w your uber l33t all knowingness in real life dude and face 2 face. You're clearly a clueless tard man and one of the most annoying kinds. One who thinks they're a genius. Not that your type of tard is uncommon by any means, all too common unfortunately. Not like you're/they're worth interacting w on or offline.

Usually don't bother addressing those kinds of people. Posted plenty of info through-out the thread from people w actual technical knowledge and credibility when discussing technical subjects, which TGT = the great tomazzi clearly has nothing of the sort. Not technical qualification not credibility. Ooooo, I will report my uberl33t findings, ummmm, could somebody tell me how to submit a bug report ? Lmao .. yeah right. :P

Tards, leading tards, leading the blind situation. Something like gnu/Linux is not so much a philosophical subject as it is a technical one. One of technologies virtues, if you have the knowledge/skill etc. a person can get down to the facts of the matter. It works, it doesn't ... there's something better or something misconfigged and can be easily corrected.

Philosophical considerations imo are clearly secondary concerns. Also clearly doesn't make sense to have a technical discussion on technical matters, with peeps who just type out tarded half baked philosophical nonsense and FUD based arguments. That's how I'm seeing this matter. However that's just me. Sheesh if the sky is falling keep wondering why all these folks whining aren't settling into Bsd and patting themselves on the back for their good judgement and having dodged an evil bullet they consider systemd to be. :D

When a tree falls in the forrest and nobody's around to hear it, does it make a sound ? More importantly did systemd take a chainsaw to it and kill da po widdle tree ???! DAM U SYSTEMD. :)
Pointless elaboration, personally am going to post a big THANK YOU, to Debian all the people involved w it and to all those responsible for all the kickbutt n awesome opensource. They've done all this for me-us, even despite us and I am grateful to them for all their efforts.

As an end-user for the most part, have zero right to criticize such awesome people. Fortunately they do have both the technical skills+knowledge and continue to be motivated by noble philosophical beliefs and commendable ideals and principles, to which they've stayed true for DECADES.

THANK YOU DEBIAN, am sure they know not everyone using this kickbutt OS are unappreciative tarded azzhats.
Most powerful FREE tech-support tool on the planet * HERE. *

goulo
Posts: 47
Joined: 2012-01-19 09:52

Re: Where will you go after systemd?

#166 Post by goulo »

Deb-fan wrote:You're clearly a clueless tard man and one of the most annoying kinds.
...
(...and lots more repetitive rambling lmao tard lmao tard...)
Speaking of annoying...
Why is every post from you written like a teenager text-messaging?

Deb-fan
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Re: Where will you go after systemd?

#167 Post by Deb-fan »

Well another obvious genius/rocket scientist among the Debian forum community. There are tons of kickbutt people in this community too.

Ya know they have this ignore feature here for blocking out users posts you don't want to read ? Yeah ... probably too much common sense for someone who likely has none. Poor widdle you, poor, poor widdle you dude. :P
Most powerful FREE tech-support tool on the planet * HERE. *

tomazzi
Posts: 730
Joined: 2013-08-02 21:33

Re: Where will you go after systemd?

#168 Post by tomazzi »

Deb-fan: grow up, man - You've just made 2 mistakes:
1. You have just bumped this thread, so anyone can verify Your claims.
2. You've bumped this thread, thinking that You can show yourself clever, but the results are exactly the opposite.

http://forums.debian.net/viewtopic.php? ... 20#p567393

Regards.
Odi profanum vulgus

schnuller
Posts: 386
Joined: 2014-11-25 05:05

Re: Where will you go after systemd?

#169 Post by schnuller »

goulo wrote:
Deb-fan wrote:You're clearly a clueless tard man and one of the most annoying kinds.
...
(...and lots more repetitive rambling lmao tard lmao tard...)
Speaking of annoying...
Why is every post from you written like a teenager text-messaging?
I for one don't understand a single post of him. Perhaps i am not willing to invest any energy in such posts.
Anyway, this is what the forum guidelines say:
A forum is a means of written communication so make sure your posts are as readable as possible. That means: Use capital letters and punctuation, and use the formatting features of the forum wisely in order to make your post attractive. Try to avoid 'l33t speak', 'chatspeak,' and 'SMS language'.
There is no need to apologize for poor English skills. We have users from all over the world and trying your best is more than adequate.
http://forums.debian.net/viewtopic.php?f=11&t=10653
In the past there haven't been such posts. At least not that long and that regularly.
I am not sure if those posts make the forum worse than it is anyway, but they sure are a good reason to ignore it completely.

Long story short:
If you do care you can report the posts as violating the forum guidelines (and hope that someone of the staff is left and bothers to act).

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edbarx
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Re: Where will you go after systemd?

#170 Post by edbarx »

Claiming technical discussions should be apolitical and strictly non-philosophical, is in itself, a philosophical stance.
Debian == { > 30, 000 packages }; Debian != systemd
The worst infection of all, is a false sense of security!
It is hard to get away from CLI tools.

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golinux
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Re: Where will you go after systemd?

#171 Post by golinux »

@edbarx . . . nice to see you. Hope all is well.
May the FORK be with you!

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thanatos_incarnate
Posts: 717
Joined: 2012-11-04 20:36

Re: Where will you go after systemd?

#172 Post by thanatos_incarnate »

edbarx wrote:Claiming technical discussions should be apolitical and strictly non-philosophical, is in itself, a philosophical stance.
Not sure if we can ever separate these. The only meaningful separation happened already -- there is a fork of Debian and there are other
distros (Gentoo) with which non-systemd distros can share upstream code.
What should really disappear is the emotional rhetoric.

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Danielsan
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Re: Where will you go after systemd?

#173 Post by Danielsan »

Too much posts to read!

This is my idea.

1. Inspired by this thread: http://forums.debian.net/viewtopic.php?f=20&t=119860. Starting from Wheezy a custom installation which not provide any sistemd components (really hard...) using as wm Echinus Wm (https://github.com/polachok/echinus/tree/tint2, this is the Tint 2 branch).

2. Starting to use Gentoo which is pretty impressive!

3. Waiting for Devuan.

....

Pass definetely to a BSD distro.

...
....
.....

Praying for HURD... :D

schnuller
Posts: 386
Joined: 2014-11-25 05:05

Re: Where will you go after systemd?

#174 Post by schnuller »

Danielsan wrote:Too much posts to read!

This is my idea.

1. Inspired by this thread: http://forums.debian.net/viewtopic.php?f=20&t=119860. Starting from Wheezy a custom installation which not provide any sistemd components (really hard...) using as wm Echinus Wm (https://github.com/polachok/echinus/tree/tint2, this is the Tint 2 branch).

2. Starting to use Gentoo which is pretty impressive!
echinus seems to be available in Gentoo:
user$ emerge --search echinus
Searching...
[ Results for search key : echinus ]
[ Applications found : 1 ]

* x11-wm/echinus [ Masked ]
Latest version available: 0.4.9
Latest version installed: [ Not Installed ]
Size of files: 33 KiB
Homepage: http://plhk.ru/echinus
Description: A window manager for X in the spirit of dwm
License: MIT

user$

pray
same here ... :-)

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thanatos_incarnate
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Re: Where will you go after systemd?

#175 Post by thanatos_incarnate »

Danielsan wrote: 3. Waiting for Devuan.
Contribute to Devuan, so it's ready once Wheezy is EOL? :)

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Danielsan
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Re: Where will you go after systemd?

#176 Post by Danielsan »

At this stage of developing there's nothing I am able to do... :(

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thanatos_incarnate
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Re: Where will you go after systemd?

#177 Post by thanatos_incarnate »

Danielsan wrote:At this stage of developing there's nothing I am able to do... :(
Well, it's not all programming... Artwork, forum spam hunting, spending 2 bucks to help them with hosting, just being productively active at the forums (helping people, etc.), writing howtos,...

schnuller
Posts: 386
Joined: 2014-11-25 05:05

Re: Where will you go after systemd?

#178 Post by schnuller »

thanatos_incarnate wrote:
Danielsan wrote:At this stage of developing there's nothing I am able to do... :(
Well, it's not all programming... Artwork, forum spam hunting, spending 2 bucks to help them with hosting, just being productively active at the forums (helping people, etc.), writing howtos,...
they have a forum?

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golinux
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Re: Where will you go after systemd?

#179 Post by golinux »

schnuller wrote:
thanatos_incarnate wrote:
Danielsan wrote:At this stage of developing there's nothing I am able to do... :(
Well, it's not all programming... Artwork, forum spam hunting, spending 2 bucks to help them with hosting, just being productively active at the forums (helping people, etc.), writing howtos,...
they have a forum?
Nope. No forum. Just the mail list and irc.
May the FORK be with you!

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Danielsan
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Re: Where will you go after systemd?

#180 Post by Danielsan »

thanatos_incarnate wrote:
Danielsan wrote:At this stage of developing there's nothing I am able to do... :(
Well, it's not all programming... Artwork, forum spam hunting, spending 2 bucks to help them with hosting, just being productively active at the forums (helping people, etc.), writing howtos,...
I have a really good idea for the logo... If they are without logo yet... The problem is that I don't have time... :(

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