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Mate 1.14 on Debian Jessie?

Graphical Environments, Managers, Multimedia & Desktop questions.
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Alley Cat
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Re: Mate 1.14 on Debian Jessie?

#21 Post by Alley Cat »

FWIW, LMDE 2 "Betsy", which is based on Jessie, has 1.14. It also has the option to not use systemd as init.
Image

Tried the rest... Now using the best!

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paschalis.sp
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Re: Mate 1.14 on Debian Jessie?

#22 Post by paschalis.sp »

Head_on_a_Stick wrote:
paschalis.sp wrote:We are now on 8.6 and still no Mate Desktop update....
There will *never* be an update to the MATE version in Debian jessie.

Please familiarise yourself with the nature of Debian releases.

And no, mixing repositories in Debian stable is not a good idea,

http://forums.debian.net/viewtopic.php?f=20&t=114130

Have you considered Arch or Fedora instead?
I am using Linux from 1999 and Debian since Etch version, so I am familiar.

This mentality should be revised, especially because debian is known for it's stability, and since applets or things stop working there *must* be an update..

Arch and Fedora are not stable..

Debian does not have to be so mainstream, but when such an update is needed, it must be provided through backports repository, in order to keep things working.
Last edited by paschalis.sp on 2016-10-05 18:03, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Mate 1.14 on Debian Jessie?

#23 Post by stevepusser »

We can sit here and squawk about about established Debian policy until the cows come home, but it won't change anything. Get involved with Debian if you want to change the policy, or fork it off into something better to your liking, or actually submit the backports to jessie-backports. I'm having too much fun playing mad scientist to get involved with the Debian politics.
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paschalis.sp
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Re: Mate 1.14 on Debian Jessie?

#24 Post by paschalis.sp »

stevepusser wrote:We can sit here and squawk about about established Debian policy until the cows come home, but it won't change anything. Get involved with Debian if you want to change the policy, or fork it off into something better to your liking, or actually submit the backports to jessie-backports. I'm having too much fun playing mad scientist to get involved with the Debian politics.
Tried to use the obs, but packages can not be updated, both by "synaptic->force package" version and "aptitude install mate-desktop-environment-core=1.16-0~bpo80.obs"

Any suggestion?

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Re: Mate 1.14 on Debian Jessie?

#25 Post by stevepusser »

Hmmm--what's the result of

Code: Select all

apt-cache-policy mate-desktop-environment mate-desktop-environment-core
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paschalis.sp
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Re: Mate 1.14 on Debian Jessie?

#26 Post by paschalis.sp »

stevepusser wrote:Hmmm--what's the result of

Code: Select all

apt-cache-policy mate-desktop-environment mate-desktop-environment-core
apt-cache policy mate-desktop-environment mate-desktop-environment-core
mate-desktop-environment:
Installed: 1.8.0+9
Candidate: 1.8.0+9
Version table:
1.16.0~bpo80.obs 0
500 http://download.opensuse.org/repositori ... ebian_8.0/ Packages
*** 1.8.0+9 0
900 http://ftp.gr.debian.org/debian/ jessie/main amd64 Packages
100 /var/lib/dpkg/status
mate-desktop-environment-core:
Installed: 1.8.0+9
Candidate: 1.8.0+9
Version table:
1.16.0~bpo80.obs 0
500 http://download.opensuse.org/repositori ... ebian_8.0/ Packages
*** 1.8.0+9 0
900 http://ftp.gr.debian.org/debian/ jessie/main amd64 Packages
100 /var/lib/dpkg/status

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paschalis.sp
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Re: Mate 1.14 on Debian Jessie?

#27 Post by paschalis.sp »

GarryRicketson wrote:
Is it safe to use the testing repository 1.14? Note that some applets are failing to update, i.e. mate-weather applet
If you are using Debian stable ,(now 8.6) , NO, it is not a good idea
to start using the "testing repos", and mixing them with the "stable" repos,you should be using the "stable" repos.
https://wiki.debian.org/DontBreakDebian

Looking at mine, which I just recently updated,and upgraded, (Sept 17)
All the mate packages upgraded to : 1.8 and 1.8.1

There is no real "mate-weather applet", the weather "applet" is
included in the "mate-applets" package, on my system, after
the upgrade, it is 1.8.1,
Are you confused about "updates" , maybe ?
See

Code: Select all

man apt-get
Read about "update", and then "upgrade",....simply running

Code: Select all

apt-get update
does not upgrade anything, it just reloads the package information,
from:'man apt-get':
update
update is used to resynchronize the package index files from
their sources. The indexes of available packages are fetched
from the location(s) specified in /etc/apt/sources.list. For
example, when using a Debian archive, this command retrieves and
scans the Packages.gz files, so that information about new and
updated packages is available. An update should always be
performed before an upgrade or dist-upgrade. Please be aware
that the overall progress meter will be incorrect as the size of
the package files cannot be known in advance.

upgrade
upgrade is used to install the newest versions of all packages
currently installed on the system from the sources enumerated in
/etc/apt/sources.list. Packages currently installed with new
versions available are retrieved and upgraded; under no
circumstances are currently installed packages removed, or
packages not already installed retrieved and installed. New
versions of currently installed packages that cannot be upgraded
without changing the install status of another package will be
left at their current version. An update must be performed first
so that apt-get knows that new versions of packages are
available.

if your package information is not showing the newer versions, and
you have tried updating, something is wrong,...

If you simply must have the shiniest newest versions, you could
upgrade your system to "testing",
OR
Also you might want to check the
"jessie backports"
You are running Debian stable because you prefer the stable Debian tree. It runs great, there is just one problem: The software is a little bit outdated compared to other distributions. That is where backports come in.
I do not know if there is any newer versions of the mate desktop utilities or
not, you should be able to check on that your self, "search" a little.
--------------- edited --------------------
No need to bother searching, I tried it myself , added jessie-backports to my sources.list, but the current version available is still 1.8. ---
I am not confused in any aspect... When things are broken, upgrades must be performed and not updates..

Thank you very much, but I am on Linux for nearly 20 years, so I pretty know the packages and how to tweak and setup my distos, for both desktop and server.

I am following also on Mate after it's first release, as I was on Gnome 2 for many years.

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Re: Mate 1.14 on Debian Jessie?

#28 Post by stevepusser »

paschalis.sp wrote:
stevepusser wrote:Hmmm--what's the result of

Code: Select all

apt-cache-policy mate-desktop-environment mate-desktop-environment-core
apt-cache policy mate-desktop-environment mate-desktop-environment-core
mate-desktop-environment:
Installed: 1.8.0+9
Candidate: 1.8.0+9
Version table:
1.16.0~bpo80.obs 0
500 http://download.opensuse.org/repositori ... ebian_8.0/ Packages
*** 1.8.0+9 0
900 http://ftp.gr.debian.org/debian/ jessie/main amd64 Packages
100 /var/lib/dpkg/status
mate-desktop-environment-core:
Installed: 1.8.0+9
Candidate: 1.8.0+9
Version table:
1.16.0~bpo80.obs 0
500 http://download.opensuse.org/repositori ... ebian_8.0/ Packages
*** 1.8.0+9 0
900 http://ftp.gr.debian.org/debian/ jessie/main amd64 Packages
100 /var/lib/dpkg/status
Obviously your system is giving priority to the stock Jessie versions, but I didn't see anything like that with the test Jessie Mate install and upgrade I did, and kaddy seems not to have either. The OBS doesn't seem to provide any "distro" version at all with its packages--maybe if you fooled around with the preferred distro in Synaptic's Preferences or adjusted the apt pinning, they'd be seen as upgrades?
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paschalis.sp
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Re: Mate 1.14 on Debian Jessie?

#29 Post by paschalis.sp »

stevepusser wrote:
paschalis.sp wrote:
stevepusser wrote:Hmmm--what's the result of

Code: Select all

apt-cache-policy mate-desktop-environment mate-desktop-environment-core
apt-cache policy mate-desktop-environment mate-desktop-environment-core
mate-desktop-environment:
Installed: 1.8.0+9
Candidate: 1.8.0+9
Version table:
1.16.0~bpo80.obs 0
500 http://download.opensuse.org/repositori ... ebian_8.0/ Packages
*** 1.8.0+9 0
900 http://ftp.gr.debian.org/debian/ jessie/main amd64 Packages
100 /var/lib/dpkg/status
mate-desktop-environment-core:
Installed: 1.8.0+9
Candidate: 1.8.0+9
Version table:
1.16.0~bpo80.obs 0
500 http://download.opensuse.org/repositori ... ebian_8.0/ Packages
*** 1.8.0+9 0
900 http://ftp.gr.debian.org/debian/ jessie/main amd64 Packages
100 /var/lib/dpkg/status
Obviously your system is giving priority to the stock Jessie versions, but I didn't see anything like that with the test Jessie Mate install and upgrade I did, and kaddy seems not to have either. The OBS doesn't seem to provide any "distro" version at all with its packages--maybe if you fooled around with the preferred distro in Synaptic's Preferences or adjusted the apt pinning, they'd be seen as upgrades?
Not any other than default preferences on Synaptic.. Your point regarding pinning may be the answer.. Any suggestion, ever since OBS is not "distro"?

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Re: Mate 1.14 on Debian Jessie?

#30 Post by stevepusser »

Kaddy has an example earlier in this thread, but I was thinking that you already have one that might be blocking the upgrade.
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Re: Mate 1.14 on Debian Jessie?

#31 Post by paschalis.sp »

stevepusser wrote:Kaddy has an example earlier in this thread, but I was thinking that you already have one that might be blocking the upgrade.
Here is my apt pinning:

pascal@debian:~$ cat /etc/apt/preferences.d/00stable
Package: *
Pin: release a=stable
Pin-Priority: 900
pascal@debian:~$ cat /etc/apt/preferences.d/10testing
Package: *
Pin: release a=testing
Pin-Priority: 100
pascal@debian:~$ cat /etc/apt/preferences.d/20Debian
Package: *
Pin: release o=Debian
Pin-Priority: -1

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Re: Mate 1.14 on Debian Jessie?

#32 Post by stevepusser »

You could temporarily disable that pinning file, then see what happens with the upgrade--at least simulate it with the the "-s" flag.

Code: Select all

apt-get -s upgrade
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paschalis.sp
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Re: Mate 1.14 on Debian Jessie?

#33 Post by paschalis.sp »

stevepusser wrote:You could temporarily disable that pinning file, then see what happens with the upgrade--at least simulate it with the the "-s" flag.

Code: Select all

apt-get -s upgrade
Thank you. :wink:

Why it needs to remove mate-settings-daemon-pulse?

Will pulseaudio be available after the upgrade?

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Re: Mate 1.14 on Debian Jessie?

#34 Post by stevepusser »

My guess was that that functionality had been folded into the newer control center instead of being separate--there seems to be a few of those for the new mate-applets, too.
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Re: Mate 1.14 on Debian Jessie?

#35 Post by paschalis.sp »

stevepusser wrote:My guess was that that functionality had been folded into the newer control center instead of being separate--there seems to be a few of those for the new mate-applets, too.
Do you mean that is integrated to the new mate control center and the applets?

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Re: Mate 1.14 on Debian Jessie?

#36 Post by stevepusser »

Updated mate-desktop, libmateweather, and mate-terminal to 1.16.1, and added mate-optimus, which is a panel applet to display the status and control the use of the Nvidia GPU in Optimus systems.
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Re: Mate 1.14 on Debian Jessie?

#37 Post by NFT5 »

Installed MATE 1.14 from stevepusser's repo.

Works just fine, except that a few applications (Synaptic, galculator, Grub Customizer and SciTE) lost formatting in their menu bars. So, what I had was like:

Code: Select all

FileEditViewHistory
instead of:

Code: Select all

File    Edit    View    History
In addition, the height of the menu bars reduced to that of the font.

Quite a lot of searching indicated it was a GTK related problem but I had no success in finding a specific answer. However, there was mention of some packages that assist in unifying the look when apps from different desktops are used. So, I installed gtk2-engines-qtcurve. This pulled in kde-style-qtcurve and I also installed gtk2-engines-oxygen (to match the icon set that I use).

Problem solved.

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Re: Mate 1.14 on Debian Jessie?

#38 Post by stevepusser »

Hmm--the reports that get to me say that most of the updaters are using the 1.16.1 OBS repo instead of the 1.14 one. That one seems to be more gtk 2 centric than the upstream Debian 1.14 version--I ported 1.16.1 from a PPA that was aiming to build against gtk 2 to avoid theming issues. I've had reports that the Arc theme works really we1l.
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Re: Mate 1.14 on Debian Jessie?

#39 Post by NFT5 »

Sorry Steve, my mistake. :oops: 1.16, not 1.14, from your Opensuse repo.

Haven't tried the Arc theme, but will when I get a chance.

Really just wanted to post up the solution. For once Google failed me and it was only following a series of links that seemed to confirm the GTK2 issue. The fix was a bit of a wild guess but I was pleasantly surprised when it worked.

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Re: Mate 1.14 on Debian Jessie?

#40 Post by stevepusser »

Just wanted to mention that the Debian 8.7 updates mentioned that they fixed the stock 1.8 weather widget by switching the weather data provider.
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