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PowerPC w/ Debian 8, fonts not rendering

Graphical Environments, Managers, Multimedia & Desktop questions.
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hirek
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Joined: 2018-12-24 07:56

PowerPC w/ Debian 8, fonts not rendering

#1 Post by hirek »

I have just installed Debian 8 (Jessie) and with it revived an old PowerPC, which so far has been a very rewarding albeit tough experience. Unfortunately, my fonts don't seem to work and after searching for hours, I cannot find a solution.
I ran the command

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dpkg-reconfigure fontconfig fontconfig-config
and the tool it starts which improved the system fonts but did not change the fonts for the menus of the LibreOffice applications or Audacious, for example, although the font renderings of the VLC media player work fine. I am attaching a few screenshots, too.
I am running OpenBox, Xorg, and said Debian on a G4 PowerMac. Thanks so much for your help!
PS: this may be of importance but I am also seeing on startup, "Failed to start Load Kernel Modules" as described here https://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=2326216 but my system starts fine, so I don't think this is issue is related.

EDIT: I changed the image to urls, so it is easier for folks with lower bandwidth to participate. Unfortunately, I could not upload any photos here, due to an 'internal server error' but I hope my current solution works just as much as one can for example only click on one photo instead of having to load the entire post.

https://i.stack.imgur.com/rUW7K.jpg

https://i.stack.imgur.com/ln0n2.jpg

https://i.stack.imgur.com/6mK40.jpg
https://i.stack.imgur.com/QSvWu.jpg
Last edited by hirek on 2018-12-26 09:55, edited 2 times in total.

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Head_on_a_Stick
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Re: Fonts not rendering

#2 Post by Head_on_a_Stick »

^ Please replace those oversized images with (thumbnail) links, we have forum users with limited bandwidth.
hirek wrote:I am running OpenBox, Xorg, and said Debian on a G4 PowerMac
Do you use a display manager? How are you starting the X session?
I am also seeing on startup, "Failed to start Load Kernel Modules"
Please post the output of

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systemctl --failed
If any units are listed in the output then please also post the output of

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journalctl -u $unit
(Replace $unit with the actual name of the failed unit file.)

Thanks!
deadbang

hirek
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Re: Fonts not rendering

#3 Post by hirek »

Hello! Thanks so much.
So, for the first question, I have changed the images to urls only. I could not upload any more images unfortunately due to a 'server error' and had some difficulty with imgur, so hopefully the selective loading will make a difference.

About the first question: I am not sure what counts as the display manager here but I have been following this post http://ppcluddite.blogspot.com/2012/03/ ... t-iii.html pretty much to the letter (save the obligatory g++ compiler and an editor, of course).

which gives the following explanation
  • 1) Xorg provides the X window server.
    2) Slim is a slim and fast login manager (LightDM is a more popular, but sometimes troublesome, choice).
    3) Openbox, obconf, and obmenu are what you need for Openbox.
    4) menu-xdg provides a Debian applications menu.
    5) The murrine and pixbuf engines are required by many third-party themes.
    6) fonts-freefont-otf and fonts-linuxlibertine provide some extra fonts I like.
    7) LXAppearance manages your themes, fonts, and icons.
The output of

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systemctl --failed
is
UNIT: systemd-modules-load.service LOAD: loaded ACTIVE: failed SUB: failed DESCRIPTION: Load Kernel Modules
with the explanation of LOAD being 'Reflects whether the unit definition was properly loaded. ACTIVE: The high-level unit actication state, i.e. generalization of SUB. SUB = The low-level unit activation state, values depend on unit type.

The output of

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journalctl -u systemd-modules-load.service
is

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systemd-modules-load[134]: Inserted module 'lp'
systemd-modules-load[134]: Failed to find module 'ppdev'
systemd-modules-load[134]: Inserted module 'parport_pc'
systemd-modules-load[134]: Inserted module 'fuse'
systemd-modules-load[134]: Failed to find module 'apm_emu'
systemd-modules-load[134]: Inserted module 'snd_powermac'
systemd[1]: systemd-modules-load.service: main process exited, code=exited, status=1/failure
systemd[1]: Failed to start Load Kernel Modules.
systemd[1]: Unit systemd-modules-load.service entered failed state.
with relevant timestamps. Thank you very much and kind regards, Hirek

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Re: Fonts not rendering

#4 Post by Head_on_a_Stick »

hirek wrote:Slim is a slim and fast login manager (LightDM is a more popular, but sometimes troublesome, choice).
^ This is wrong.

SLiM is dead upstream and does not support systemd login sessions correctly.

LightDM is better (it supports systemd-logind) but runs X as root.

GDM(3) will run X as the normal user, as will plain `startx` from a console login, which would be my preferred option.
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Re: Fonts not rendering

#5 Post by Head_on_a_Stick »

hirek wrote:The output of

Code: Select all

journalctl -u systemd-modules-load.service
is

Code: Select all

systemd-modules-load[134]: Inserted module 'lp'
systemd-modules-load[134]: Failed to find module 'ppdev'
systemd-modules-load[134]: Inserted module 'parport_pc'
systemd-modules-load[134]: Inserted module 'fuse'
systemd-modules-load[134]: Failed to find module 'apm_emu'
systemd-modules-load[134]: Inserted module 'snd_powermac'
systemd[1]: systemd-modules-load.service: main process exited, code=exited, status=1/failure
systemd[1]: Failed to start Load Kernel Modules.
systemd[1]: Unit systemd-modules-load.service entered failed state.
Check any files under /etc/modules-load.d/ and comment out any lines that force those failed modules (ppdev & apm_emu).

Reference: https://askubuntu.com/questions/877245/ ... d-to-start
Last edited by Head_on_a_Stick on 2018-12-24 16:52, edited 1 time in total.
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hirek
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Re: Fonts not rendering

#6 Post by hirek »

Thank you so much! So you reckon the font problem and systemd problem as in the output are linked together then? I shall try xstart as per your suggestion and report back from the front lines.

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Re: Fonts not rendering

#7 Post by Head_on_a_Stick »

hirek wrote:So you reckon the font problem and systemd problem as in the output are linked together then?
Perhaps, a broken login session can cause many strange problems.

I await the results of your investigation with great antici...
deadbang

hirek
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Re: Fonts not rendering

#8 Post by hirek »

So, I seem to have solved the load Kernel modules issue and now the command does not reveal any failed modules.
The
apm_emu
is commented out and the mysterious
ppdev
actually comes from

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cups-filters.conf
in

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/etc/modules-load
and is part of the printer server. I have (for now) uninstalled the print server (it was the standard Debian) one and will reinstall another one later.

I have also taken some inspiration from your answers on this thread here: http://forums.debian.net/viewtopic.php?t=123148.

Now, I will revisit the issue of a print server at some later point, possibly with the help of this gentleman here http://www.alandmoore.com/blog/2013/11/ ... ght-remix/.

Next up today is the display manager. I think I shall go for your recommended GDM(3) or startx, possibly startx since it is supposed to be a lightweight system.

I shall report back for more.

hirek
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Re: Fonts not rendering

#9 Post by hirek »

So, after lengthy trial and error I determined Debian's fonts must have gotten messed up somehow.

I uninstalled all the software listed above and tried a different set of them listed here http://www.alandmoore.com/blog/2013/11/ ... ght-remix/ which still had the font problem. Then I removed the last common overlap, which was OpenBox and tried IceWM, to no avail. I then caved and installed Xfce4, and still had the terrible, unreadable fonts. Then, I figured it must be Debian's system files themselves at fault so I went to square one and found this:
https://www.linuxbabe.com/desktop-linux ... ogle-fonts which strikes me as a very blunt tool that surely must have altered more than was necessary but that fixed it for sure.

The commands specifically were adding this to the sources file

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deb http://ppa.launchpad.net/no1wantdthisname/ppa/ubuntu trusty main
deb-src http://ppa.launchpad.net/no1wantdthisname/ppa/ubuntu trusty main
deb http://ppa.launchpad.net/no1wantdthisname/ppa/ubuntu trusty main
deb-src http://ppa.launchpad.net/no1wantdthisname/ppa/ubuntu trusty main
add the key and run updates etc.

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apt-key adv --keyserver keyserver.ubuntu.com --recv-keys E985B27B
apt-get update
apt-get install fontconfig-infinality
then hit

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sudo bash /etc/fonts/infinality/infctl.sh setstyle
and select the 'Linux' font and put

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USE_STYLE="UBUNTU"
in the file

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 /etc/profile.d/infinality-settings.sh
.

Now, for my own edification, do you think you can point me to where the problem lay? As I said, I think these steps fix more than was broken but as the old adage goes, never touch a running system... but still it would be helpful to know.

Thanks so much!

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Re: Fonts not rendering

#10 Post by Head_on_a_Stick »

hirek wrote:Debian's fonts must have gotten messed up somehow
Unlikely.

In my (x86) experience, the fonts in the current stable release look better than those in Win10, once configured.
^ This is unwise, Debian is not compatible with Ubuntu and if that repository has a newer libc version then you may have just wrecked your system.

https://wiki.debian.org/DontBreakDebian ... nkenDebian

If the Infinality configuration really does fix your problem then re-install from scratch and use the configuration file I linked to earlier, that always works for me.

Otherwise, put "PowerPC" in the thread title to attract the attention of users familiar with the intricacies of that architecture, this may be a graphics problem.
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Re: Fonts not rendering

#11 Post by Head_on_a_Stick »

Hold on a minute!

Are all of the misbehaving applications Qt-based?

If so, try installing qt5-gtk-platformtheme for the stable release.

For testing/unstable, install qt5ct and add this line to ~/.profile:

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export QT_QPA_PLATFORMTHEME="qt5ct"
The qt5ct program can then be used to adjust the settings for Qt-based programs.
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hirek
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Re: PowerPC w/ Debian 8, fonts not rendering

#12 Post by hirek »

Hi!
Are all of the misbehaving applications qt-based
So, I am not really sure about the qt basis. They were all of openbox's system dialogs, Audacious, LibreOffice but not the VLC player, for example. Libre office is gtk if I understood this source https://www.kdab.com/libreoffice-and-plasma/correctly. The VLC player, which always had good fonts, does rely on the qt library, so qt is less likely to be a problem here?


About
In my (x86) experience, the fonts in the current stable release look better than those in Win10, once configured.
, where would I insert this file in the file system?

Thank you so much and kind regards!

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Re: PowerPC w/ Debian 8, fonts not rendering

#13 Post by Head_on_a_Stick »

hirek wrote:So, I am not really sure about the qt basis. They were all of openbox's system dialogs, Audacious, LibreOffice but not the VLC player, for example. Libre office is gtk if I understood this source https://www.kdab.com/libreoffice-and-plasma/correctly. The VLC player, which always had good fonts, does rely on the qt library, so qt is less likely to be a problem here?
OK, perhaps not then.
hirek wrote:About
In my (x86) experience, the fonts in the current stable release look better than those in Win10, once configured.
, where would I insert this file in the file system?
~/.config/fontconfig/fonts.conf

And I've just noticed that you're trying all this with Debian 8 (jessie), why is that?

Have you tried stretch? The current stable release has improved font rendering compared to the last version.
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hirek
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Re: PowerPC w/ Debian 8, fonts not rendering

#14 Post by hirek »

I shall try these config file this evening and if need be reindtall Debian. My main use is scientific computing on a budget. Unfortunately, the Debian website states
Debian 9 regrettably removes support for the following architecture:

PowerPC (powerpc).
I am thus stuck with Jessie, but so far she has played ball, with CMake, g++, and Emacs :-).

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Re: PowerPC w/ Debian 8, fonts not rendering

#15 Post by Head_on_a_Stick »

I think OpenBSD supports your hardware:

https://ftp.openbsd.org/pub/OpenBSD/6.4 ... ALL.macppc

The 6.4 release has superb font rendering OOTB, see my scrots in the non-Debian desktop screenshot thread.
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Re: PowerPC w/ Debian 8, fonts not rendering

#16 Post by xepan »

hirek wrote:I shall try these config file this evening and if need be reindtall Debian. My main use is scientific computing on a budget. Unfortunately, the Debian website states
Debian 9 regrettably removes support for the following architecture:

PowerPC (powerpc).
I am thus stuck with Jessie, but so far she has played ball, with CMake, g++, and Emacs :-).
As far i can tell you can install Debian Sid though:
https://forums.macrumors.com/threads/ho ... 4.2146795/
I haven't made up my mind yet if i should use Debian Sid or OpenBSD, for the next few months i will just stick to old-stable.

Most people won't know that powerpc comes with it's own problems and solutions and think they can just apply what they know from their PC's. It is not always the case. Take answers with a grain of salt.

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Re: PowerPC w/ Debian 8, fonts not rendering

#17 Post by hirek »

Hi! Thanks so much for your reply! One quick question before inviting Sid: is that not supposed to be the unstable release, error-prone and likely to crash?

hirek
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Re: PowerPC w/ Debian 8, fonts not rendering

#18 Post by hirek »

@head_on_a_stick I am wondering, what if there is no folder

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~/.config/fontconfig/fonts.conf
?

Would I just create the directory and hope that some package picks it up automatically or is the lack of directory indicative of something major not working here?

Thanks so much for all your help!

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Re: PowerPC w/ Debian 8, fonts not rendering

#19 Post by GarryRicketson »

This is more of opinion, but Debian SID can be ok, if you really know what you are doing, but yes, it also can crash, "SID", is the bad boy that breaks toys, that is partly why they used the name, but it also stands for Still In Development, this means everything is kind of maybe good, maybe not, and a advanced user knows how to deal with all of that.
by xepan »As far i can tell you can install Debian Sid though:
https://forums.macrumors.com/threads/ho ... 4.2146795/
I haven't made up my mind yet if i should use Debian Sid or OpenBSD, for the next few months i will just stick to old-stable
Now , I wouldn't think twice about it, but back when Debian was Debian 7 wheezy, I started thinking twice, and ended up going to OpenBsd, have not looked back since then.
But OpenBsd is not for every one, but it is a very good option to look into.

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Re: PowerPC w/ Debian 8, fonts not rendering

#20 Post by Head_on_a_Stick »

hirek wrote:what if there is no folder

Code: Select all

~/.config/fontconfig/fonts.conf
?

Would I just create the directory
Yes.
deadbang

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