Improve memory usage in Debian

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Re: Improve memory usage in Debian

Postby Deb-fan » 2019-07-14 12:13

My dang gnu-nix forum bug has reared its ugly head again! Had to Google Kwin(KDE windows manager, transitioning into a Wayland compositor.) Gotta agree with Hallvor, like comparing pears to oranges, when you've never eaten an orange and already much prefer pears anyway. Someone would have to actually use xyz DE/WM and get somewhat familiar with them, before they can even form a valid opinion.

Ten mins of playing with one of them realistically doesn't cut it or give the chance to find out what they can do. What can be done to or with them. Doesnt matter I guess we all have plenty of choices.
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Re: Improve memory usage in Debian

Postby sickpig » 2019-07-14 12:13

No what? Xorg makes the screen freeze not the wm.
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Re: Improve memory usage in Debian

Postby Hallvor » 2019-07-14 12:24

sickpig wrote:No what? Xorg makes the screen freeze not the wm.



Since you did not read the link:

With a stacking manager, the repainting process can become corrupted when a program that is slow, unresponsive or buggy does not respond to messages in a timely manner.[5][6] A malicious program can cause the system to appear unstable by simply neglecting to repaint its window. Then, one or more of the following conditions may result:

a clipped window does not repaint uncovered regions, resulting in either blank spaces or a "trail" left behind from another window
portions of windows (such as decorative drop shadows) are left behind and not properly painted over
the mouse pointer is corrupted[7][unreliable source]
screen updates become unbearably slow[8]
the entire screen freezes until the program either responds or is terminated[9]

With a compositing manager, if a window stops repainting itself when requested by the window manager, its last repaint will remain displayed and the window might be dimmed. Often the title changes to reflect the status of the window as unresponsive. A program may prevent its window from being moved or unmapped, but generally will not cause repainting problems.


https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Compositi ... w_managers


Anything wrong with that?
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Re: Improve memory usage in Debian

Postby sickpig » 2019-07-14 12:34

No, both kwin and openbox r stacking wms. I think compositing makes kwin such a cpu hog.
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Re: Improve memory usage in Debian

Postby Deb-fan » 2019-07-14 13:01

Don't take Wikipedia as an authority. Have never seen such behavior from openbox or any wm/de I've used. Though would be easy enough to remedy on any of them too. If anything sounds like a gpu-vid driver situation and would have say big DE's would be more prone to such because they're inherently more complex. Though get tons of dev attention too, shrugs. Nobody has to really mess with openbox either though, it's been rock solid so long. No reason for major rewrites.
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Re: Improve memory usage in Debian

Postby Hallvor » 2019-07-14 13:16

I used Openbox for about six months a few years ago, and I encountered several problems with repainting. Mind you, this was not on Debian, so the applications were less tested, but issues such as these are real.

Sickpig: It is compositing by default, but it can be turned off. Yes, compositing will eat CPU. Have you tried installing Compiz to see how it compares to Kwin with compositing on?
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Re: Improve memory usage in Debian

Postby sickpig » 2019-07-14 13:31

No I haven't. I don't need compositing to be productive. I was just drawn into the whole DE coolaid, nd was impressed by kde videos on utube and of course u saying it's not resource intensive. I agree kde looks great. But the constant background CPU usage irritates me.
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Re: Improve memory usage in Debian

Postby Hallvor » 2019-07-14 13:41

You should have turned compositing off, then. But by all means, stick with what you like best.
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Re: Improve memory usage in Debian

Postby Deb-fan » 2019-07-14 13:44

Really starting to look like you guys should do pistols @ dawn + 10 paces thing. :D Messing round fellas. Compositioning will make a difference. Though he's mentioned it can be turned off. Same for plenty of other things, components and services in an out-of-box can be really heavy DE. They can be tweaked. Whereas with something like openbox, in my view much more about what x-person chooses to install and mainly tweaking the underlying operating system. Same time a totally plain Jane openbox, without some good customization applied is hideously bare and desolate. This is coming from a guy whose strongly considering getting rid of the openbox right click menu,never use it anymore. :)
Last edited by Deb-fan on 2019-07-14 13:45, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Improve memory usage in Debian

Postby sickpig » 2019-07-14 13:44

Hmm, yes I agree. I shall try that tomorrow. Now watches finals :)
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Re: Improve memory usage in Debian

Postby Deb-fan » 2019-07-14 13:51

^ Try which one, pistols @dawn or turning off compositor? OK shutting it for awhile too. :)
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Re: Improve memory usage in Debian

Postby sickpig » 2019-07-14 22:29

yup u guys were right compositing was the culprit
kwin without compositing 2% cpu with compositing around 10-12%
openbox with or without compositing(compton) 0% cpu
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Re: Improve memory usage in Debian

Postby Hallvor » 2019-07-15 15:59

sickpig wrote:yup u guys were right compositing was the culprit
kwin without compositing 2% cpu with compositing around 10-12%
openbox with or without compositing(compton) 0% cpu


That looks like a more healthy number, but 10-12% with compositing seems high. I am not near that number on any of my computers.

A standalone window manager and compositor is hardly a fair comparison with a full desktop environment. It is like comparing a bike with a car. (Of course the bike is lighter, but it can do a lot less.) Compare it with Gnome, Mate, XFCE or maybe Unity.
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Re: Improve memory usage in Debian

Postby sickpig » 2019-07-16 02:51

WM does not necessarily do less in any way compared to a DE because the underlying functionality is still provided by the OS. Cant think of a single thing which cant be done in WM and is exclusive to a DE. But DEs definitely provide the bling and eye candy out of the box though, can't dispute that. But omg so many configuration options, m lost in all the thousands of menus. has a learning curve for sure.

I added a simple xdtool shortcut(alt+f4) to close windows in KDE top panel. it works but every-time i click on it, it works but then gives a prompt on the desktop saying kde cant launch it? hello u already did :), don't know, small niggles, but DE looks polished. i havent figured out all the options yet.
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Re: Improve memory usage in Debian

Postby Hallvor » 2019-07-16 19:00

WM does not necessarily do less in any way compared to a DE


It does less by its very definition.

I added a simple xdtool shortcut(alt+f4) to close windows in KDE top panel.


Not sure if I understand you correctly, but close application with Alt + F4 is the default shortcut, but you can customize it any way you want in Systemsettings.
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