Ubuntu vs Debian

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Re: Ubuntu vs Debian

Postby CwF » 2019-12-21 14:20

Debian is.
Ubuntu is debian with fancy paint and stickers that often flakes off.
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Re: Ubuntu vs Debian

Postby Chrisdb » 2019-12-21 14:24

neuraleskimo wrote:
Chrisdb wrote:IMHO a better question would be why everyone on this forum uses Debian as their (main) distro.

Maybe a separate sticky post would be helpful to prevent such future questions...

Good ideas. Go for it...


Here we go :D

http://forums.debian.net/viewtopic.php?f=30&t=144676
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Re: Ubuntu vs Debian

Postby golinux » 2019-12-21 16:00

Head_on_a_Stick wrote:Debian is better because of the Social Contract.
I now bring your attention to item #4 of said Social Contract:
4. Our priorities are our users and free software

We will be guided by the needs of our users and the free software community. We will place their interests first in our priorities. We will support the needs of our users for operation in many different kinds of computing environments . . .
And the reality of the pending General Resolution: Init systems and systemd on which users have no vote:
Choice 1: F: Focus on systemd
May the FORK be with you!
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Re: Ubuntu vs Debian

Postby Head_on_a_Stick » 2019-12-21 16:04

^ I really don't think users should have a vote in GRs and I don't agree with you characterisation of the available choices. Furthermore I have linked the popcon statistics (over on your forums) which show that only ~1% of Debian users are booting with sysvinit so it does look like the community has already decided.

Anyway, this is all getting off-topic. Why do you prefer Debian (or Devuan) over Ubuntu?
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Re: Ubuntu vs Debian

Postby oswaldkelso » 2019-12-22 00:59

Head_on_a_Stick wrote:^ I have linked the popcon statistics (over on your forums) which show that only ~1% of Debian users are booting with sysvinit so it does look like the community has already decided.


Hoas stop taking the piss.

1. Ordinary users won't do anything but run the default so that's most of that 99%.
2. The many technical users just accept it, if they like it or not.
3. The other technical users have jumped ship to other distros.

Maths can say what ever the mathematician wants it to say :-)

Anyway back on topic. Given we have such as short list of distros and if my life depended on having to make a choice I'd choose Debian
Ash init durbatulûk, ash init gimbatul,
Ash init thrakatulûk agh burzum-ishi krimpatul.
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Re: Ubuntu vs Debian

Postby Head_on_a_Stick » 2019-12-22 10:59

oswaldkelso wrote:Hoas stop taking the piss.

Never! :mrgreen:

And don't get me wrong, I do agree with your points but if the apostates had remained, installed sysvinit-core and enabled popcon that might have forced the hand of the developers in respect of alternate init system support.
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Re: Ubuntu vs Debian

Postby golinux » 2019-12-22 15:41

Head_on_a_Stick wrote:
oswaldkelso wrote:Hoas stop taking the piss.

Never! :mrgreen:

And don't get me wrong, I do agree with your points but if the apostates had remained, installed sysvinit-core and enabled popcon that might have forced the hand of the developers in respect of alternate init system support.
Very telling that you would suggest that it's the victim's fault for not accepting the continuing assaults of the abuser.
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Re: Ubuntu vs Debian

Postby neuraleskimo » 2019-12-22 15:58

Chrisdb wrote:
neuraleskimo wrote:
Chrisdb wrote:IMHO a better question would be why everyone on this forum uses Debian as their (main) distro.

Maybe a separate sticky post would be helpful to prevent such future questions...

Good ideas. Go for it...


Here we go :D

http://forums.debian.net/viewtopic.php?f=30&t=144676

Very good and thanks. But, the link doesn’t work.
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Re: Ubuntu vs Debian

Postby golinux » 2019-12-22 16:05

It did for me maybe 12 hours ago.
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Re: Ubuntu vs Debian

Postby Soul Singin' » 2019-12-22 16:07

golinux wrote:
Head_on_a_Stick wrote:And don't get me wrong, I do agree with your points but if the apostates had remained, installed sysvinit-core and enabled popcon that might have forced the hand of the developers in respect of alternate init system support.
Very telling that you would suggest that it's the victim's fault for not accepting the continuing assaults of the abuser.

We're all human. We all have a tendency to "blame the victim."

So let's think clearly. Would a bunch of sysvinit-core in popcon really "force the hand of the developers?" The vehement opposition to systemd did not "force their hand," so what reason is there to think that some statistics would?
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Re: Ubuntu vs Debian

Postby golinux » 2019-12-22 16:19

Soul Singin' wrote:So let's think clearly. Would a bunch of sysvinit-core in popcon really "force the hand of the developers?" The vehement opposition to systemd did not "force their hand," so what reason is there to think that some statistics would?
HoaS is grasping at straws. Freedom is always at risk even under the guise of "free software". We need a fifth freedom because the 4 current ones are obviously inadequate to deal with free software that is essentially being "weaponized" to limit/control users freedoms.
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Re: Ubuntu vs Debian

Postby Head_on_a_Stick » 2019-12-22 17:09

neuraleskimo wrote:

Very good and thanks. But, the link doesn’t work.

There was already a thread about that so the mods merged it: viewtopic.php?f=20&t=39415&p=712633

Soul Singin' wrote:what reason is there to think that some statistics would?

Because Debian use popcon to inform decisions like this and the current figures have been used on the mailing lists as an argument for dropping support for alternative init systems.

Anyway, enough of this diversion, please open a new thread if you (or golinux) want to discuss this further. Thanks.
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Re: Ubuntu vs Debian

Postby Danielsan » 2019-12-23 14:23

Head_on_a_Stick wrote:Debian is better because of the Social Contract. The only contact Ubuntu want is a financial one...


Because of that Debian is organized rationally and all the packages available are organized horizontally, I mean all of them have the same importance no matter what one is an essential library or a fancy utility. In Ubuntu there are packages that are considered important and are in the main repo and packages that are considered second class citizen, available in the universe repo, and those can be buggy for an entire cycle (even in a LTS). Ubuntu is quite prone to promote proprietary software against the floss alternatives.
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Re: Ubuntu vs Debian

Postby Mr. Lumbergh » 2019-12-31 01:09

Chrisdb wrote:IMHO a better question would be why everyone on this forum uses Debian as their (main) distro.

Maybe a separate sticky post would be helpful to prevent such future questions...

What about those that use and love it but don't necessarily consider it their "main?" :wink:
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