Any way to control an undetected fan?

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Any way to control an undetected fan?

Postby efdevse » 2020-06-22 19:59

I have this old laptop I'm setting up for a friend (so he can try Linux). It's a Fujitsu Amilo Si 1520, and the BIOS doesn't have any options for CPU or fan controls — and it gets quite hot.

The fan works, but in an unwanted way. It starts at ≈ 60°C, and stops again at 50°C. In between it's all quiet.

I installed TLP installed and set it up to run in battery mode all the time. That keeps it mostly at ≈ 55°C. Still to warm.

The problem is that neither sensors-detect or pwmconfig pick up the fan, and I haven't found anything in the proc|sys-files that hopefully could indicate at least something about the fan. Was hoping to find some values to fiddle around with.

The fan is an ADDA AB5505HB-HBB. A 4-pin fan, but not a PWM …appearently.

Here's a pic if that helps:
Image

Is there any way to control the fan, without hardware modding? It would be great if I could set a low rpm, like a “min-speed”, or if is a way to manually change the interval from 40-50 (instead of 50-60).

Any ideas?

Best,
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Re: Any way to control an undetected fan?

Postby cuckooflew » 2020-06-23 04:42

Hamster Powered Fan

Create an electrical connection to a fan that you build yourself without any batteries. Connect the fan to the hamster wheel however you want. Through trial and error, power the fan by having the hamster turn the wheel.
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Re: Any way to control an undetected fan?

Postby efdevse » 2020-06-23 13:24

cuckooflew wrote:Hamster Powered Fan

Haha… That'd be something. :mrgreen: Well, I live on the countryside, so there are always small mices running around. Perhaps I can catch one and teach him the job. :P

Would prefer to get the fan working tho… :–)
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Re: Any way to control an undetected fan?

Postby LE_746F6D617A7A69 » 2020-06-23 14:19

Hmm... but how the mouse will now whether to run faster or slower?
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Re: Any way to control an undetected fan?

Postby stevepusser » 2020-06-23 14:44

No, most laptop fans cannot be detected and controlled by Linux. You may be able to modify the BIOS to change the temperatures at which it engages and stops, or even the kernel driver which controls it, but that is more complicated.
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Re: Any way to control an undetected fan?

Postby efdevse » 2020-06-23 17:33

stevepusser wrote:No, most laptop fans cannot be detected and controlled by Linux. You may be able to modify the BIOS to change the temperatures at which it engages and stops, or even the kernel driver which controls it, but that is more complicated.

Yes, it is. I'll see if I can come up with som hardware modding instead. Had an idea of feeding a low voltage to the fan to make it spin at a slow speed all the time – and if I could control the power flow with some diods, so it can run when/if the fan wants to run like it wants to. My neighbour is an electrictian, so I'll have to bounce that idea with him. :–)
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Re: Any way to control an undetected fan?

Postby LE_746F6D617A7A69 » 2020-06-23 18:53

efdevse wrote:The fan works, but in an unwanted way. It starts at ≈ 60°C, and stops again at 50°C. In between it's all quiet.

I installed TLP installed and set it up to run in battery mode all the time. That keeps it mostly at ≈ 55°C. Still to warm.


Nope, it's not too warm - the CPU is not a human - it can easily withstand temperatures over 36.6 deg.C :)

This is a common misunderstanding, that the lower the CPU temps are somehow "better" - while in fact, the only task for cooling systems is to keep the CPU temperature below some critical level, at which the thermal throttling becomes necessary. For most CPUs, thermal throttling starts at 65..75 degrees Celsius -> so basically, Your laptop cooling system works properly.
Of course, we could discuss here whether the fan speed profile could be better or not - but this is not changing the basic fact -> it works correctly.

Regards.
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Re: Any way to control an undetected fan?

Postby efdevse » 2020-06-23 20:11

LE_746F6D617A7A69 wrote:Nope, it's not too warm - the CPU is not a human - it can easily withstand temperatures over 36.6 deg.C :)

This is a common misunderstanding, that the lower the CPU temps are somehow "better" - while in fact, the only task for cooling systems is to keep the CPU temperature below some critical level, at which the thermal throttling becomes necessary. For most CPUs, thermal throttling starts at 65..75 degrees Celsius -> so basically, Your laptop cooling system works properly.
Of course, we could discuss here whether the fan speed profile could be better or not - but this is not changing the basic fact -> it works correctly.

Regards.

Thanks for your input. +1 Yes, from a technical standpoint you are abs correct. What I meant is th laptop it self gets way too hot, and is still too warm. When running i normal mode, on power… It gets really hot down the right side. That is not the CPU*, but a chipset I saw under the Wi-Fi card. And when I say hot - I mean so hot that you can't rest you hand there. Now, when I run it ≈ 55°C, it's not that hot – but still quite warm.

I'm going to give this one away (after my friend have been testing it). So, it'd be nice to be able to lower the heat (children?). Being a tiny 12" laptop with nearly no space inside… that doesn't help either. But, it responds well, is kind of snappy, and RAM har so far not exceeded 800MB (of 3GB). :–)

* CPU is a 35W Core 2 Duo (T7200)
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Re: Any way to control an undetected fan?

Postby Dai_trying » 2020-06-23 20:41

This might work for you if you are adventurous.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ocTOD0vBFgc
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Re: Any way to control an undetected fan?

Postby efdevse » 2020-06-23 21:28

Dai_trying wrote:This might work for you if you are adventurous.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ocTOD0vBFgc

Yes, maybe something like that, but in reverse. I need to make it spin, when it's not - instead of slowing it down.
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Re: Any way to control an undetected fan?

Postby stevepusser » 2020-06-24 03:29

Has it ever been disassembled and all the accumulated dust and drek cleaned out? If the CPU isn't too hot, it probably doesn't need repasting.

And some laptops just run hot, no matter what. Some Apple products were infamous for that--form over function.
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Re: Any way to control an undetected fan?

Postby efdevse » 2020-06-24 04:00

stevepusser wrote:Has it ever been disassembled and all the accumulated dust and drek cleaned out? If the CPU isn't too hot, it probably doesn't need repasting.

And some laptops just run hot, no matter what. Some Apple products were infamous for that--form over function.

Everything is cleaned out, and new paste on the CPU. First thing I did - even before installing anything. Good practice. :–) Yes, I guess the smaller laptop it is, the less of room for the heat to move around. And it is an older CPU: 34W/65nm. Just a tiny bit of constant airflow would do a lot, but I don't want to lose original fan control, so it can speed up when it needs to. That'd be great, if possible.
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Re: Any way to control an undetected fan?

Postby Dai_trying » 2020-06-24 06:39

efdevse wrote:
Dai_trying wrote:This might work for you if you are adventurous.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ocTOD0vBFgc

Yes, maybe something like that, but in reverse. I need to make it spin, when it's not - instead of slowing it down.


I didn't re-watch the whole video but I recall it was spinning permanently at a constant speed set by the amount of voltage drop from the diodes, but that could have been another video I've watch quite a few of his, but still wouldn't give you speed control.
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Re: Any way to control an undetected fan?

Postby efdevse » 2020-06-24 06:57

Dai_trying wrote:I didn't re-watch the whole video but I recall it was spinning permanently at a constant speed set by the amount of voltage drop from the diodes, but that could have been another video I've watch quite a few of his, but still wouldn't give you speed control.

Yes, his problem was a fan spinning constant, at a loud/high speed, and he dropped the voltage with 3 diods.
My issue is that it's not spinning at all, between the fan spins up to kool it. And that is what makes the surface so hot.
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Re: Any way to control an undetected fan?

Postby LE_746F6D617A7A69 » 2020-06-24 08:49

A relatively simple solution would be to inject PWM signal from a separate generator (f.e. build on NE555 chip), but in the first post You've said that HW modding is not an option - so there's only one option left: You have to get used to it ;)
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