GUI VS Terminal

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Which editing method would you use?

GUI / Windowed interface
11
19%
Terminal session
46
81%
 
Total votes : 57

Postby ro » 2008-11-07 07:46

Mr B wrote:Maybe some of the preference comes down to if you are a "visual" person or "verbal" - so that some people will always feel more comfortable with a gui as opposed to cli; For myself I find gui aps easier to learn (or learn the "route" to a solution) than a string of cli stuff (partly because I don't know what most of it means (yet). That being said I do use cli for more and more stuff and it is fascinating to learn what is actual happening behind the gui front ends ( and of course there are times when it is a "life saver" as discussed previously).

As an illustration of the "visual" nature of how I use gui stuff I have managed to confuse myself several times when I have played about with icon themes etc and found that the different "look" means that I have to think twice about what I am doing.......

GUI or CLI - errr.........BOTH!!


I agree fully. I too am a visual thinker and conceptualizer and prefer a gui. It's why I can remember many configuration manoeuvres from Mandriva 10, like editing grub (or lilo or whatever it was) even though I haven't used it for years, while I tend to have to refer to notes for Debian.

edbarx wrote:The power of the CLI lies in its simplicity. A shell need not be complicated, it only needs to display text rather than elaborate graphics. This means, that in the case of system breakdown, the CLI is the tool of choice. It is not because it is faster or simpler, but because, it is simple to run and its power is unlimited. A Windows user can use recovery console, but that, compared to the Linux shell, is like a six month old!


Oh, we understand - it's just that some of us find CLI counterintuitive and much harder to use. It's a matter of neurology...
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Postby ro » 2008-11-07 07:57

I forgot to add that I haven't voted because the poll reeks of stupid elitism.
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Postby edbarx » 2008-11-07 08:17

ro wrote:
edbarx wrote:The power of the CLI lies in its simplicity. A shell need not be complicated, it only needs to display text rather than elaborate graphics. This means, that in the case of system breakdown, the CLI is the tool of choice. It is not because it is faster or simpler, but because, it is simple to run and its power is unlimited. A Windows user can use recovery console, but that, compared to the Linux shell, is like a six month old!


Oh, we understand - it's just that some of us find CLI counterintuitive and much harder to use. It's a matter of neurology...


Neurons have nothing to do with the CLI and GUIs can be counter-intuitive too! Designing a powerful intuitive GUI is not at all straightforward. And by the way, who told you that I am against GUIs? For your information, I use kde. I am defending the CLI, because, its power in case of system breakdown, is almost total. You can do everything without the interference of a complex desktop. That is what I mean by "simplicity". I am far from boasting that the CLI is simple in terms of remembering commands. This can also be said about human languages: no one learns to speak in a couple of days! The reason is that language is a complex ability. The same applies to commands of the CLI. The good news are, that unlike MS Windows, the commands are conservative, that is, they do not change unnecessarily. :)
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It is hard to get away from CLI tools.
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Postby ro » 2008-11-07 09:18

Uh, where did I say you were against GUIs? I'm pretty sure I only said that some of us find them easier to get around than CLI. I know they add complexity that can cause things to go pop as much as I know the power and elegance of the CLI. I know the CLI is indispensable at times. I had to use it when I lost my desktops temporarily to a bug a few months ago.

I just wish I had the sort of brain that finds CLI easy. Neurology IS important because it determines one's reaction to stimuli. I feel it's a plausible reason why some users take well to the CLI. I remember things very much better if I have a picture. Maybe it's a matter of practice... :?
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Postby edbarx » 2008-11-07 09:46

I misunderstood you. Please, excuse my misunderstanding. :oops:
When shall Devuan, the New Sun, rise over the horizon? It is too dark and cold with systemd.
Classical Debian was {freedom, reliability, stability, configurability, flexibility, security}
It is hard to get away from CLI tools.
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Postby ro » 2008-11-07 09:52

That's OK - I'm famous for doing the same :lol:
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Postby DtW » 2008-11-07 13:09

I don't care to vote but I'll describe my environment instead: KDE + Emacs + Iceweasel + XTerm (with screen). These are the ones you can see all the time on my two-monitor desktop. Of course I use other applications too but others are more like temporary tools.

I guess my point is that "GUI or CLI" is not very interesting question. With Linux I think most people use both. More interesting question is what kind of working environments people build for themselves.
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Postby Lou » 2008-11-07 14:12

Maybe i don't see the gui/CLI problem clearly, to me speed and simplicity is the core of my preference towards the CLI.

Say you want to edit a file, (/etc/apt/sources.list) a file that is common and that you have to edit in Debian at least once in order to configure what you want.

So you launch a gui editor, gedit, conkeror or whatever, you hit the icon and presto you got it.
I press F1 in icewm or F6+c in ratpoison and get the terminal, by the time you reach for your mouse and find the icon, i got you beaten.

Now you have to write the file you want to edit in the gui <name of file>, same in the cli (nano -wx <name of file>, same speed, now you're in the file editing. You save/exit from both. Seems to me the only difference is how you launch the editor.

Now if for some reason once you launch debian and there is a problem entering the X system, you CANNOT launch a gui editor, what are you gonna do?

What if you don't know the address of the file you're looking (your neurons are shot to hell), you launch your editor and use 'locate' or 'find', simple, no?

$ nano locate sources

what so mind bogling about this?
I think it's psychological, the fear to abandon something you learn in Windows.

Of course this is all my opinion, and with it and a quarter you can buy a cup of coffee down here.
Last edited by Lou on 2008-11-07 15:28, edited 1 time in total.
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Postby anarchyinc666 » 2008-11-07 14:40

Wow, now I feel a lot better. For the longest time I thought that Linux users had a stereotype were they refused to use windows in preferance of the more intimidating command line interface. You all have let me see the light. It is all just a matter of personal preferance, what you are more comfortable with and how fast one can do what needs to be done.

Almost every reply has been the same, we all use both. Thanks for showing me that the stereotype is nothing more than a stereotype.

Now, can someone tell me how to remove that gay poll?
-----BEGIN GEEK CODE BLOCK-----
Version: 3.12
GIT d- s: a- C++++ UL++++ P+ L+++ E-- W+++ N- o-- K- w++
O- M-- V-- PS+++ PE+++ Y PGP+++ t-- 5-- X+++ R* tv+++ b DI++++ D
G e+ h---- r+++ y++++
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Postby Mikuro » 2008-11-07 15:00

Text editing may seem like the classic CLI-friendly task, but I look at it from the other direction: A GUI text editor is basically just the same, but with some advantages that come with the mouse and menus. Like Lou said, the difference is not so much with the app as with the way of accessing the app. I frequently use the command line to launch GUI programs (including GUI text editors). Does that make me a GUI fan or a CLI fan?

I think it points to flaws in the design of individual GUIs, but not the GUI in general.
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Postby MeanDean » 2008-11-07 15:14

not knowing the CLI and needing it is very different than knowing the CLI and not needing it
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Postby Lou » 2008-11-07 15:26

Mikuro wrote:I frequently use the command line to launch GUI programs (including GUI text editors). Does that make me a GUI fan or a CLI fan?


We all do that at one point or another, the only difference is that in icewm and ratpoison i launch a Run Box:

IceWM: Windows key + spacebar
Ratpoison: ctrl + spacebar

especially, when i want to launch xfe as root (sudo xfe) in order to delete a file NOT in my /home.

I'm just playing with vimperator in iceweasel, having a ball, it has increased my productivity so far. The keyboard is faster in most cases.
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Postby Mr B » 2008-11-07 15:35

ro wrote:stupid elitism.


Isn't all elitism stupid? :P :P :P :P :P

As I get more and more comfortable with Linux I wish I could make more use of cli - but I find it very difficult to remember the commands and being slightly dyslexic as well find it rather frustrating!
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Postby vmclark » 2008-11-07 15:59

Regarding the visual versus verbal issue. Isn't it ALL visual. Don't you "see" the text?! I surely don't hear them.

I think it has more to do with picture form as oppose to words.
Last edited by vmclark on 2008-11-08 03:19, edited 1 time in total.
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Postby jshipley84 » 2008-11-07 16:06

Syntax highlighting is something that I've never been particularly fond of in emacs. It looks good enough, but sometimes it takes quite a while for emacs to update the highlighting.

Every other text editor that I've ever used that did syntax highlighting updated it instantly.
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