I wish people would just to a basic Google search

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dcihon
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I wish people would just to a basic Google search

#1 Post by dcihon »

I wish people would just to a basic Google search before posting their error messages.
If they just did that at least they would learn something about their issue.
Also they need to do a basic inxi -Fxx to let people helping them to get some information on their systems.
I see so many posts that people fail to do the basic help requirements.
They could save a lot of peoples time and effort to help them.

Maybe when you go to Post a new topic these questions could be shown to the OP before he starts his or hers post?

I am probably wasting my time just typing this but if one new person reads this and does it maybe it is worth it.

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Ardouos
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Re: I wish people would just to a basic Google search

#2 Post by Ardouos »

dcihon wrote:I wish people would just to a basic Google search before posting their error messages.
If they just did that at least they would learn something about their issue.
Also they need to do a basic inxi -Fxx to let people helping them to get some information on their systems.
I see so many posts that people fail to do the basic help requirements.
They could save a lot of peoples time and effort to help them.

Maybe when you go to Post a new topic these questions could be shown to the OP before he starts his or hers post?

I am probably wasting my time just typing this but if one new person reads this and does it maybe it is worth it.
Or if you want to plant trees: http://ecosia.org/
Or if you want privacy: duckduckgo.com/startpage.com

:)

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bw123
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Re: I wish people would just to a basic Google search

#3 Post by bw123 »

I think it's possible there is an effort to "poison the well" because just too many posts are complete nonsense. The forum has spam hunters and other administrators that deal with it... it usually works okay.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Poisoning_the_well

On the other hand, there are also people who only post here to get their links posted to their blog or debian derivative/alternative or whatever agenda they have. That's harder to spot, but the key giveaway is when they HAVE NO CLUE HOW DEBIAN WORKS. They keep posting how great windows is, how some other distro does things, or obvious errors in basic debian administration.

Sometimes, they travel in pairs, or in groups. You will notice people often post to the same threads that appear out of nowhere. Is it one person with several accounts? is it some random coincidence? Yeah, who knows, who cares, I can spot a fake a mile away.

This should probably go to forum feedback or off topic, but you never know. Don't Worry about it. Posting on here is not a waste of time, sometimes reading on here is, LMAO!!

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Thorny
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Re: I wish people would just to a basic Google search

#4 Post by Thorny »

bw123 wrote:This should probably go to forum feedback or off topic, but you never know. Don't Worry about it. Posting on here is not a waste of time, sometimes reading on here is, LMAO!!
+1
Yup!
dcihon wrote:I wish people would just to a basic Google search before posting their error messages.
Or if they would read http://forums.debian.net/viewtopic.php?f=30&t=47078 but that often doesn't happen either.

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GarryRicketson
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Re: I wish people would just to a basic Google search

#5 Post by GarryRicketson »

Most of us wish they would do a search before asking, but sadly many don't,
what irritates me even more is when they flat out lie, saying things like :
In this thread: http://forums.debian.net/viewtopic.php? ... 57#p664832
by johans »
I tried it, and when I ran into errors I looked everywhere on the web with the errors I get.
Liars make my blood pressure go up, and especially when it is such a blatant
obvious lie.
It is one thing when some one says something that is not true, but they think it is, because they are misinformed, that is different.
If you look at the thread though, you will notice in the first post, they do not even include the error messages, but ok, I suppose some poor handicaped
persons might not think of something like that,... But then replies, when asked,
by debiman » what errors? you need to show us.
Very clearly stated, "You need to show us", even someone with severe handicaps should be able to understand that , but NOoooo, this person fails to
understand, and follows up with a reply, that includes a link to a totally useless blog, one that does not even show up in search results, if one does a real search on this kind of problem, (php, myphpadmin, mysql, etc).
And then the person quickly comes up with excuses for not being able to post the error messages,
I tried it, and when I ran into errors I looked everywhere on the web with the errors I get.

I can sadly not show you the exact errors now as the server is at work and I will only be there again on Monday.
Telling us they looked every where is a flat out lie, ................

Give me a break, if this person had really pasted the error messages into a search engine, they would have gotten better results then the useless blog they are trying to promote, I know this for a fact, because when I first started installing php, phpmydamin, etc on my servers, I did have my share of problems, and all ways found good results, when I used the error messages as my key words.
Any way, yes this kind of thing irritates me to no end, it is obviously spam to me, but the OP will cry, lie and whine, claiming they needed to post a link to a useless blog , that does not show in any searches, (yet, but now that they have posted the link here it will probably start showing up), and that makes me even madder, because some ---no polite words come to my mind--- promotes a useless blog, and it pollutes the search engines, adding more spam to them, that has to be weeded through when doing a search, this kind of thing makes it harder to get good search results.
I thought about reporting the post, and asking admins or a mod to remove the links to the use less blog, .... but then I felt discouraged, and decided "Why bother ? ",...
Any way, yea I wish people would try to do some searches first, or at least just be honest, and tell us the truth "Hello, I only have a few minuets on my break, and don't have time,...",... Or I don't know how to search good, ...
There is a lot of this :
by bw123 »On the other hand, there are also people who only post here to get their links posted to their blog or debian derivative ---snip---
And if they really had a genuine problem, with real error messages, and had done a search, they would not need to ask the question, nor have a excuse to post a link to their use less blog,...
Quite often a moderator does remove the links, but some times that opens up a new can of worms,...
Really all we can do is try to politely encourage people to search first, and when members see posts that maybe are questionable, report them, explain why in the notes field on the report,...
We, spam hunters, as well as admins and mods do read all of the reports, when it is cleverly disguised spam , or not so obvious spam, then us spamhunters need to wait and see what a admin or mod say as well, any way, that is all for now from me.
===== edit ============
by bw123 »Sometimes, they travel in pairs, or in groups. You will notice people often post to the same threads that appear out of nowhere. Is it one person with several accounts? is it some random coincidence? Yeah, who knows, who cares, I can spot a fake a mile away.
Actually, all of the above, sometimes it is 1 person, with several accounts, other times random coincidence,..other times AI (artificial intelligence) bots,...1 person can create several, each one registers as a individual, there are a lot of people experimenting with these kind of bots, and when no body (human) seems to notice, or notices, well, that is what the"turing test" is, and the ones humans don't spot pass.
We had a couple not to long ago, that failed miserably, ... but I suppose that would be another topic.
A problem, but minor, these AI bots, and it is a fascinating subject, field to me,
they can be programmed to play on human emotions,.. for example everyone , or most people with even just a little compassion,... well quite often a bot , can be confused with a human that is some what handicapped mentally, and when cornered, the bot will try to take advantage of that,...there are ways though to
trap and determine if it is a bot or not, but again that is a whole other topic.
Sorry,...
Last edited by GarryRicketson on 2018-01-29 03:45, edited 3 times in total.

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Thorny
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Re: I wish people would just to a basic Google search

#6 Post by Thorny »

But, Garry, what do you think of bw123's suggestion that this could be in Forum stuff & feedback, you covered just about everything else. :-)

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GarryRicketson
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Re: I wish people would just to a basic Google search

#7 Post by GarryRicketson »

Oh, yea,... I forgot on that, well it probably would be more appropriate in
Forum stuff & feedback

But, only a mod or admin can decide on that, actually I can move it to Forum stuff & feedback, but only if the OP (dichon) asked me to do that.
I can not move it, just because, I think it would be better, or some other member thinks so,... hope that makes sense.
Us "spam hunters" are not supposed to do that, moderators or admins usually do so, if they agree.
There is a pretty good chance, next time a admin comes online they will move it,....

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Thorny
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Re: I wish people would just to a basic Google search

#8 Post by Thorny »

I didn't suggest that you do it, I just solicited your opinion. No doubt an admin will look at this thread and make the call. All these bumps should ensure that it is noticed. They might think we are arguing. ;-)

Bed time for me, Buenas noches!

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Re: I wish people would just to a basic Google search

#9 Post by GarryRicketson »

Ok, well, "don't let the bed bugs bite",...
And no , you didn't suggest that I do it, but I added that in case some one wondered, since I agreed why I didn't just move it as well...

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Thorny
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Re: I wish people would just to a basic Google search

#10 Post by Thorny »

[now OT], thanks to whoever moved it.
GarryRicketson wrote:Ok, well, "don't let the bed bugs bite",...
As Lisa Simpson would say, bed bugs??? :-O .....:-)

And now, Buenos días, Garry.

dcihon
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Re: I wish people would just to a basic Google search

#11 Post by dcihon »

Garry,
You can move this post if it has a better place for it.
I didn't look very hard at all the categories and saw General Discussion and thought it was a good place for a General Discussion (Ha Ha). That was a joke.
Thanks
Dan

P.S. If I ever become guilty of doing the things I have posted in this thread please let me know. I don't want to do the wrong thing and want help from people here. I mean no disrespect to anyone here trying to help.

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Re: I wish people would just to a basic Google search

#12 Post by Thorny »

It's already moved.

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Re: I wish people would just to a basic Google search

#13 Post by bw123 »

found this very interesting

Help Vampires: A Spotter’s Guide
http://slash7.com/2006/12/22/vampires/

anticapitalista
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Re: I wish people would just to a basic Google search

#14 Post by anticapitalista »

dcihon wrote: Also they need to do a basic inxi -Fxx to let people helping them to get some information on their systems.
Is inxi installed by default now on Debian?
antiX with runit - lean and mean.
https://antixlinux.com

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GarryRicketson
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Re: I wish people would just to a basic Google search

#15 Post by GarryRicketson »

No it isn't, you have to install it. In most of the threads / topics where it is suggested to use inxi person suggesting to use it , also tells them they may need to install it.
For example here:
http://forums.debian.net/viewtopic.php? ... &p=627966&
And several 100 other threads.

As well as doing a search first, about 99% of the questions asked on this forum, have been answered many times , in various topics, threads,... but who takes the the time to browse or search the forum , and read anything ?

Realize of course each situation usually has some kind of details that make the users problem unique, still if members browse and search the forum first
they would at least get some idea of what information is needed, and what packages they need to install to get that information.

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Re: I wish people would just to a basic Google search

#16 Post by bw123 »

GarryRicketson wrote: Other times AI (artificial intelligence) bots,...1 person can create several, each one registers as a individual, there are a lot of people experimenting with these kind of bots, and when no body (human) seems to notice, or notices, well, that is what the"turing test" is, and the ones humans don't spot pass. We had a couple not to long ago, that failed miserably, ... but I suppose that would be another topic.
I have noticed you do seem fascinated with the subject of AI. I first became aware of how it can fool people around 1993, when I had a bbs prog named "Chat With LISA" and I tell you what, this thing was smart. I still have it, and fire it up occasionally. She's kinda one of those "Hot Bots" if you do it right she will really get off. Pretending to be drunk, sending pics, giving out phone number, etc. It really is amazing, and it is ANCIENT.

This chat prog fooled hundreds of people on bulletin boards, it is just that good. I can't imagine how much things have advanced since then.

I imagine the first test a bot would make is see if the post gets deleted, or replied to. If it's not too personal, how does the forum deal with that?

If I understand things correctly, the "turing test" is given to humans, not to AI?

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Re: I wish people would just to a basic Google search

#17 Post by sunrat »

anticapitalista wrote:
dcihon wrote: Also they need to do a basic inxi -Fxx to let people helping them to get some information on their systems.
Is inxi installed by default now on Debian?
It's a shame it isn't installed by default. Unfortunately many posters who fail to search for answers to their issues which have already been posted multiple times also fail to be able to install it.
“ computer users can be divided into 2 categories:
Those who have lost data
...and those who have not lost data YET ”
Remember to BACKUP!

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GarryRicketson
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Re: I wish people would just to a basic Google search

#18 Post by GarryRicketson »

I imagine the first test a bot would make is see if the post gets deleted, or replied to----snip---
Most are not very smart, unless they get banned as well, when the post is deleted, they come back and post again,...and so on.
@ by bw123 » I decided better to start a topic in "off topic"
AI bots, search bots, spam bots, so many bots, turing tests

dcihon
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Re: I wish people would just to a basic Google search

#19 Post by dcihon »

Maybe we could add in here how to install and use inxi basic command to get the info needed.:
http://forums.debian.net/viewtopic.php?f=7&t=47078

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GarryRicketson
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Re: I wish people would just to a basic Google search

#20 Post by GarryRicketson »

People that don't do searches, also don't read any of the "beginners topics", like the one you refer to, nor the "read this before your first post" , they register, then sometimes they actually do take the time to browse the topics, but not really all that often, so if they happen to notice "Beginners Questions", they go there, start a new topic, and post the problem,.. they do not do any searches, browse the forum and look for other topics on the same problem, or anything
else to try to help their selves.
In relation to the 'inxi' command, utility,... it really was just a example, but any way, I think something that would really be a benefit to the forum, would be if some one started a new "Beginner's Guide", one that is more up-to-date, and can be applied to the current Debian versions. If it is well written, I am sure the admins would consider "sticky" it, so it stays at the top.
It could be titled : The New 2018 Beginners Guide ( or something like that).
But still, these "help vampires", the kind of people that don't do any searches, do not read anything that might help them, as well as do not do any searches.
In any event some members , new beginners and even more experienced ones, would read a Beginners Guide, that is more current and up to date, I am sure of that. (If we had one).
Some one suggests or asks that the OP uses "inxi" and posts the out put. And even includes in the suggestion "You may need to install it",... logic would
say to myself, "Oh, but I don't know how to install it", So I do a simple search , keywords:

Code: Select all

How to install inxi on Debian 
, instead of posting a reply, with yet another question,..but I am not a "help vampire". These help vampires, and others (mindless bots) just looking for a excuse to post links to some blog they or their friend wrote, well they won't read the "beginners guide", and won't do any kind of search, and will post yet another question, or a comment pointing toward the site they want to promote.
Like wise, some one that uses the lame excuse: " I don't have time",...honestly,...do you think some one that does not have time to copy/paste :

Code: Select all

How to install inxi on Debian  
into a search box, (engine),... Do you really think they will have and take the time to read your answer , when you post the answer on "How to install inxi on Debian"... ?
Probably not, or the next question will follow,... when you say :

Code: Select all

apt-get install inxi 
"Oh , but I don't want to use the terminal, is there a GUI I can use ? "....
A help vampire is never satisfied,... they all ways will come up with more questions, and refuse to do any searches, getting very indignant , when it is suggested.
========== edited =====
Just today, yet another one, this is a classic example of someone that did 0 zero searches, nor browsed the forum, or anything before they posted.
http://forums.debian.net/viewtopic.php? ... 43#p665240

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