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[Thread Retired] Look forward to Debian 12 "Bookworm"!

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Re: Look forward to Debian 12 "Bookworm"!

#21 Post by ooglaboogla »

I have been wondering this myself. Some people don't seem to understand the question. I'm guessing these are Debian "stable" users who never really paid attention to Debian 11 Bullseye until it became stable. Myself, I've been a Debian 11 user for quite a while, using Bullseye/Sid, as well as recently adding the Experimental repo so I could force the latest version of Firefox. It's been my daily driver for months. After Bullseye became stable and Debian 11 was officially released, I assumed that the weekly testing build of Debian on the unofficial server would soon change to Debian 12, using the Bookworm repo. That hasn't happened yet. Since I want to be running Debian 12 Bookworm/Sid now that Bullseye has become stable and boring, (just kidding) I went ahead and added the bookworm repo. Simple enough. (deb http://deb.debian.org/debian bookworm main contrib non-free) I did this in the GUI Software Sources app. The repo added successfully and there were a few updates, but here's the strange part. When I added the repo, it was shown as "Debian 12 Testing." Great, just what I wanted. But after reopening the app, it is no longer shown in my sources. When I open a terminal and check for updates, it checks the Bookworm repo. I figure this will all be sorted out eventually, so I'll just wait. Also strange that after Debian 11 was officially released, my OS identification changed from Debian 11 Bullseye to Debian Unstable Sid. That didn't change after adding the Bookworm repo. Oh well, we'll see how it goes. The OS still works just fine, but I am looking forward to Debian 12 Bookworm/Sid. I like Rolling Debian.

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Re: Look forward to Debian 12 "Bookworm"!

#22 Post by craigevil »

ooglaboogla wrote: 2021-08-29 15:31 I have been wondering this myself. Some people don't seem to understand the question. I'm guessing these are Debian "stable" users who never really paid attention to Debian 11 Bullseye until it became stable. Myself, I've been a Debian 11 user for quite a while, using Bullseye/Sid, as well as recently adding the Experimental repo so I could force the latest version of Firefox. It's been my daily driver for months. After Bullseye became stable and Debian 11 was officially released, I assumed that the weekly testing build of Debian on the unofficial server would soon change to Debian 12, using the Bookworm repo. That hasn't happened yet. Since I want to be running Debian 12 Bookworm/Sid now that Bullseye has become stable and boring, (just kidding) I went ahead and added the bookworm repo. Simple enough. (deb http://deb.debian.org/debian bookworm main contrib non-free) I did this in the GUI Software Sources app. The repo added successfully and there were a few updates, but here's the strange part. When I added the repo, it was shown as "Debian 12 Testing." Great, just what I wanted. But after reopening the app, it is no longer shown in my sources. When I open a terminal and check for updates, it checks the Bookworm repo. I figure this will all be sorted out eventually, so I'll just wait. Also strange that after Debian 11 was officially released, my OS identification changed from Debian 11 Bullseye to Debian Unstable Sid. That didn't change after adding the Bookworm repo. Oh well, we'll see how it goes. The OS still works just fine, but I am looking forward to Debian 12 Bookworm/Sid. I like Rolling Debian.
From neofetch:
OS: Debian GNU/Linux bookworm/sid aarch64

my sources.list

Code: Select all

cat /etc/apt/sources.list
# Unstable See: https://wiki.debian.org/DebianUnstable
deb https://deb.debian.org/debian unstable main contrib non-free
# deb-src https://deb.debian.org/debian unstable main contrib non-free

# Unstable-Debug  https://wiki.debian.org/HowToGetABacktrace
# deb https://deb.debian.org/debian-debug/ unstable-debug main contrib non-free

# Experimental See: http://wiki.debian.org/DebianExperimental
deb https://deb.debian.org/debian experimental main contrib non-free
# deb-src https://deb.debian.org/debian experimental main contrib non-free

# Experimental-Debug https://wiki.debian.org/AutomaticDebugPackages
# deb https://deb.debian.org/debian-debug/ experimental-debug main contrib non-free

# Incoming https://incoming.debian.org/
deb https://incoming.debian.org/debian-buildd buildd-unstable main contrib non-free

# Testing (Bookworm) 
# deb https://deb.debian.org/debian testing main contrib non-free
# deb-src https://deb.debian.org/debian testing main contrib non-free
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Re: Look forward to Debian 12 "Bookworm"!

#23 Post by pwzhangzz »

There's an article about using Experimental repo to upgrade Bullseye Kernel to 5.13:

https://www.linuxcapable.com/how-to-ins ... debian-11/

Before I give it a try, can someone enlighten me how to remove the Experimental repo and return the Linux kernel to 5.10 if things go awry?

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Re: Look forward to Debian 12 "Bookworm"!

#24 Post by ooglaboogla »

Oops. Guess I can't have Debian 12 Bookworm/Sid until I remove the Bullseye repo. Duh. Preparing to break my system...

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Re: Look forward to Debian 12 "Bookworm"!

#25 Post by craigevil »

pwzhangzz wrote: 2021-08-29 17:40 There's an article about using Experimental repo to upgrade Bullseye Kernel to 5.13:

https://www.linuxcapable.com/how-to-ins ... debian-11/

Before I give it a try, can someone enlighten me how to remove the Experimental repo and return the Linux kernel to 5.10 if things go awry?
If you are on Bullseye I would suggest sticking with the Bullseye repos.

Code: Select all

# Bullseye https://www.debian.org/releases/bullseye/amd64/release-notes/ch-upgrading.en.html
deb https://deb.debian.org/debian/ bullseye main contrib non-free
# deb-src https://deb.debian.org/debian/ bullseye main contrib non-free

# Bullseye Security https://www.debian.org/releases/bullseye/amd64/release-notes/ch-information.en.html#security-archive
deb https://deb.debian.org/debian-security bullseye-security main contrib non-free
# deb-src https://deb.debian.org/debian-security bullseye-security main contrib non-free

# Bullseye Updates https://wiki.debian.org/DebianBullseye#FAQ 
# https://wiki.debian.org/StableUpdates All packages from stable-updates will be included in point releases.
deb https://deb.debian.org/debian bullseye-updates main contrib non-free
# deb-src https://deb.debian.org/debian bullseye-updates main contrib non-free

# Bullseye Backports  https://backports.debian.org/
deb https://deb.debian.org/debian/ bullseye-backports main contrib non-free
# deb-src https://deb.debian.org/debian/ bullseye-backports main contrib non-free

# Bullseye Proposed Updates https://wiki.debian.org/StableProposedUpdates
# Stable-proposed-updates is an apt repository that contains the files that are being prepared for the next Debian/Stable point release.
# deb https://deb.debian.org/debian/ bullseye-proposed-updates main contrib non-free 
# deb-src https://deb.debian.org/debian/ bullseye-proposed-updates main contrib non-free
If you are on Testing/Bookworm or Sid you should have no problems installing the kernel from Experimental.
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Re: Look forward to Debian 12 "Bookworm"!

#26 Post by wizard10000 »

pwzhangzz wrote: 2021-08-29 17:40Before I give it a try, can someone enlighten me how to remove the Experimental repo and return the Linux kernel to 5.10 if things go awry?
As craigevil mentioned, not recommended.

But - Sid and Bullseye are running the same kernel and I'm running 5.13 on Sid so it *should* work on Bullseye.

Installing 5.13 won't remove your 5:10 kernel so if you run into issues you can always boot into 5:10.

The easiest way to do this is in synaptic - check it out:

Image

Note that I have Experimental unchecked. If the box is unchecked Debian comments out the entry in sources.list so *don't* forget to deactivate the repo when you're done.

Activate the repo, (check the box) hit "Reload" and install linux-image-5.13.0-trunk-amd64. When done, uncheck the box and hit reload again.

Hope this helps -
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Re: Look forward to Debian 12 "Bookworm"!

#27 Post by ooglaboogla »

I had said earlier that I was about to go break my installation or something like that. Didn't happen. I can't hardly break Debian even if I'm trying to. Other distros seem to fall apart on their own. Anyway, I guess I am unofficially running Debian 12 Bookworm/Sid, though it is not yet able to call itself that. Just calls itself Debian GNU/Linux unstable sid. After I commented out all of the Bullseye repos as well as Sid and Experimental, so that Bookworm was the sole repo, I checked for updates then upgraded. Briefly, it called itself Debian GNU/Linux testing bookworm. But as soon as I added back the Sid repo and updated, it changed back to unstable sid. Adding the Experimental repo makes no difference with that. Now I'm using only 3 repos, Bookworm, Sid and Experimental. Using the Force Version option from the Package menu in Synaptic, I now have Firefox 91, Thunderbird 91, Cinnamon 5.05 (Yes, I use Cinnamon on Debian. Stop laughing.), and Kernel 5.13.12. Yes, I gots some Rolling Debian. Still seems very stable. Will still be my daily driver. Kind of disappointed I couldn't figure out how to break it.

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Re: Look forward to Debian 12 "Bookworm"!

#28 Post by sunrat »

ooglaboogla wrote: 2021-09-02 01:07Briefly, it called itself Debian GNU/Linux testing bookworm. But as soon as I added back the Sid repo and updated, it changed back to unstable sid.
As soon as you added the sid repo and upgraded you are running Sid, not Testing.
It's not "Debian 12" until it's released. Enjoy ~2 years of looking forward to it.
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Re: Look forward to Debian 12 "Bookworm"!

#29 Post by ooglaboogla »

"As soon as you added the sid repo and upgraded you are running Sid, not Testing.
It's not "Debian 12" until it's released. Enjoy ~2 years of looking forward to it."

The Debian 11 Alpha was released in December of 2019, about 4 months after Debian Buster became the stable release, so I look forward to Debian 12 Alpha in December, FYI. Besides, the Software Sources GUI already identifies the Bookworm repo as Debian 12 when you add it. I don't wait for the stable release. I've been using Debian 11 for about a year. Now I'm using Debian 12. Also, the CPU-X app identifies my OS as Debian GNU/Linux Bookworm/Sid now. The System Info app calls it unstable sid. Wait for 2 years if you want while your Bullseye turns stale and grows mold on it. I'm not.

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Re: Look forward to Debian 12 "Bookworm"!

#30 Post by pwzhangzz »

ooglaboogla wrote: 2021-09-02 01:07 I guess I am unofficially running Debian 12 Bookworm/Sid, though it is not yet able to call itself that. Just calls itself Debian GNU/Linux unstable sid.
I edited the /etc/apt/source.list file and replaced "bullseye" with --sid--. After an "apt update" and "apt full-upgrade" the system now calls itself "Bookworm/sid":
Screenshot from 2021-09-01 20-38-09.png
Screenshot from 2021-09-01 20-38-09.png (242.61 KiB) Viewed 14656 times
Could you kindly show us your /etc/apt/source.list file? I really would like to add the experimental repo and upgrade the kernel to 5.13.

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Re: Look forward to Debian 12 "Bookworm"!

#31 Post by craigevil »

My actual /etc/apt/sources.list:

Code: Select all

# Unstable See: https://wiki.debian.org/DebianUnstable
deb https://deb.debian.org/debian unstable main contrib non-free
# deb-src https://deb.debian.org/debian unstable main contrib non-free

# Unstable-Debug  https://wiki.debian.org/HowToGetABacktrace
# deb https://deb.debian.org/debian-debug/ unstable-debug main contrib non-free

# Experimental See: http://wiki.debian.org/DebianExperimental
deb https://deb.debian.org/debian experimental main contrib non-free
# deb-src https://deb.debian.org/debian experimental main contrib non-free

# Experimental-Debug https://wiki.debian.org/AutomaticDebugPackages
# deb https://deb.debian.org/debian-debug/ experimental-debug main contrib non-free

# Incoming https://incoming.debian.org/
deb https://incoming.debian.org/debian-buildd buildd-unstable main contrib non-free

# Testing (Bookworm) 
# deb https://deb.debian.org/debian testing main contrib non-free
# deb-src https://deb.debian.org/debian testing main contrib non-free
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Re: Look forward to Debian 12 "Bookworm"!

#32 Post by craigevil »

What os-release shows:

Code: Select all

cat /etc/os-release
PRETTY_NAME="Debian GNU/Linux bookworm/sid"
NAME="Debian GNU/Linux"
ID=debian
HOME_URL="https://www.debian.org/"
SUPPORT_URL="https://www.debian.org/support"
BUG_REPORT_URL="https://bugs.debian.org/"
Image
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Re: Look forward to Debian 12 "Bookworm"!

#33 Post by ooglaboogla »

A lot of back and forth and misinformation on this thread. For those of you that want Debian 12 Bookworm, you can have it now, and I'll tell you why. Your version of Debian is determined by your base repo. Although Sid can be set up as your sole repo, it is not a base repo, so it really doesn't have a version, other than Debian Unstable. The base repos are oldstable (Buster), stable (Bullseye), and testing (Bookworm). Anybody still using Buster needs to get a life. Bullseye is now the stable release. Buster was version 10. Bullseye was always version 11, since the first Alpha release in December of 2019. It was the Testing repo until last month. Bookworm is version 12. It is the new Testing repo, and I hope there will be an actual Debian 12 Testing release in December, where we'll start to see things like a Debian 12 Grub theme and wallpapers. Right now, we don't have that. But, if you edit your sources list so that Bookworm is your sole repo, then update, you will effectively have Debian 12 Bookworm. I use Sid as well, so I'm running Debian 12 Bookworm/Sid. Eventually, it will identify itself that way. Right now, it identifies in the boot dialog as Debian GNU/Linux Bookworm/Sid. I also use the Experimental repo to get Firefox 91, Thunderbird 91, Cinnamon 5.05, and Kernel 5.13, but upgrades from that repo don't happen automatically. They must be forced, which I do in Synaptic. If you want Debian 12 Bookworm now, just change your repo and get it. deb http://deb.debian.org/debian bookworm main contrib non-free (Unless you're one of those that only wants main.) For those who keep saying that Debian 12 won't be released for 2 years, you are absolutely wrong. In 2 years, Debian 12 Bookworm will become the stable release. You can have it right now, as Debian Testing (Bookworm.) I expect an ISO to be available for it before the end of the year. Happy Testing.

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Re: Look forward to Debian 12 "Bookworm"!

#34 Post by craigevil »

There are already Testing ISOs.
https://cdimage.debian.org/images/unoff ... etinst.iso
https://cdimage.debian.org/images/weekl ... etinst.iso

Build date 8-30-2021.

Although they might still say Bullseye when installed. But if they are using Testing repos then they are Testing/Bookworm.
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Re: Look forward to Debian 12 "Bookworm"!

#35 Post by sunrat »

ooglaboogla wrote: 2021-09-03 23:32 A lot of back and forth and misinformation on this thread.
True.
Anybody still using Buster needs to get a life.

That statement loses you most of your credibility. Stable is the raison d'être of Debian's existence. Testing and unstable are development versions, not releases. There are valid reasons for using oldstable.
For those who keep saying that Debian 12 won't be released for 2 years, you are absolutely wrong. In 2 years, Debian 12 Bookworm will become the stable release. You can have it right now, as Debian Testing (Bookworm.)
It's just semantics. Nobody said you can't install Sid or/Testing/Bookworm now. It's just not officially called "Debian 12" until it is released.
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Re: Look forward to Debian 12 "Bookworm"!

#36 Post by ooglaboogla »

BTW, in 2 years, I'll be hooking up with Debian 13 Trixie.

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Re: Look forward to Debian 12 "Bookworm"!

#37 Post by dilberts_left_nut »

ooglaboogla wrote: 2021-09-04 00:20 BTW, in 2 years, I'll be hooking up with Debian 13 Trixie.
I doubt it.
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Re: Look forward to Debian 12 "Bookworm"!

#38 Post by pwzhangzz »

Weekly-live-builds of " Testing" hybrid iso images are still dated August 9, 2021.

https://cdimage.debian.org/cdimage/unof ... so-hybrid/

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Re: Look forward to Debian 12 "Bookworm"!

#39 Post by Islander »

ooglaboogla wrote: 2021-09-03 23:32Anybody still using Buster needs to get a life. Bullseye is now the stable release. Buster was version 10. Bullseye was always version 11, since the first Alpha release in December of 2019. It was the Testing repo until last month.
I've missed the latest stable version for a whole month?!

Mea culpa! I need to spend more time watching Debian releases!

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Re: Look forward to Debian 12 "Bookworm"!

#40 Post by ooglaboogla »

I was being a bit sarcastic when I said that anybody using Buster needs to get a life. I know a lot of people are still using Debian 10 Codename Buster. I never used it. I tried it out about a year ago, when I was using MX Linux 19, based on it. But as I tried other distros I became aware that Buster was stale, as in 2 years old now , and changes in package versions allowed on it pretty much locked out. When I started using Debian, I started with Debian 11 Testing Codename Bullseye about a year ago. Bullseye is now the stable version. It's not stale yet, because it just recently locked in, with updated packages through the summer of 2021. Still, I want the latest, and I want a Rolling release, so I always add the Sid repo to my base repo. My base repo is now Bookworm, which is the Codename for Debian 12. The codename for Debian 13 is already known to be Trixie, but that repo won't become available as the Testing repo until the Fall of 2023, when Bookworm becomes the Stable release.

Computer
********


Summary
-------

-Computer-
Processor : AMD FX(tm)-6300 Six-Core Processor
Memory : 8059MB (952MB used)
Machine Type : Desktop
Operating System : Debian GNU/Linux bookworm/sid
User Name : oogla (Oogla Boogla)
Date/Time : Sat 04 Sep 2021 10:20:23 AM EDT

This is the first few lines of a hardinfo report of my current system. It's an older PC that still runs any Linux distro very well, and still runs Windows 10 21H1 just fine. It is still set up to dual-boot them, although I really don't use Windows anymore. Debian Bookworm/Sid is much more stable and reliable than Windows 10 ever was, so I have no problem using it as my daily driver. Debian's idea of "Unstable" is very stable in comparison to other distros. It never breaks itself. It's hard to break it yourself. Debian is just the best.

As for the difference between Bookworm/Sid and just Sid, there's not much difference. Except that when the Bookworm Security and Updates repos become active over the next few months, I will be able to get Bookworm security updates as they are made available, if I want them. If I was only using Sid, I wouldn't have that option. I may or may not use that option, but that's the difference. Sid does not completely override your base repo.

I talked about using the Experimental repo as well. I have found that nothing updates automatically from this repo, so it doesn't matter if you leave it active on your sources list. Many packages, such as Kernel, Firefox, Thunderbird, Cinnamon, and others have very recent versions available on this repo. To use them, I use the Force Version option in Synaptic Package Manager. This is how I got Debian Cinnamon on version 5.05, running Kernel 5.13, Firefox 91, and Thunderbird 91, using nothing except the official Debian repos. The only software I install that didn't come from the Debian repos is Hypnotix. If it becomes available on the Debian repos one day, I won't have to get that from the Mint repo anymore. (I don't have the Mint repo installed. I just download the deb package from the Mint repo in Firefox. I have to keep an eye on it and update manually when they come out with a new version.)

Anyway, enough of that. Happy Debian 12 Bookworm Testing, and Happy Debian 11 Bullseye Stable for those who stick with the stable branch.

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